Fighter Pilot Doc's Secret to Elite Health!

[00:00:00] Speaker A: And that's when I really started to read about, okay, how sick are we? Chronic disease, you know, diabetes, cardiovascular disease, obesity, cancer. The big ones that we all hear about. Then peeling back the onion, literally. You know, where do you find the root cause of most of that is the lifestyle. I looked at food that way. Medical school, we never talked about nutrition. I had a colleague reach out to me, and he's like, hey, Jay, what do you know about ketones? My response was, it's a path. It's the result of a pathologic state. Because what was I thinking about keto? Exactly. It was a bad word, right? So you kind of get this in your brain that ketones are bad. And I responded that way. And he's like, no, I'm not talking about dka, diabetic ketoacidosis. I'm talking about ketones. And I'm like, well, what do you mean? And I just dove into the research, and then I started reading, and I even called Richard V. That is what really changed my mind into this conversation. So if you're in the medical industrial complex and you don't support somebody who's out there talking about making the country healthy, then what are we doing? It's almost. Almost universal theme. I lost trust in my doctor. I lost trust in. In public health. I lost trust in nih. I lost trust in cdc. Yep, dude, that's me, too. I. So I share that same confusion and. And distrust with them a lot. [00:01:42] Speaker B: Welcome to the Duster Mud Podcast. [00:01:44] Speaker C: I'm Rich and I'm Shelly. [00:01:46] Speaker B: Here on the Duster Mud Podcast, we like to talk about food freedom and farming. And, boy, have we got a special guest for you today that is going to allow us to hit on all three of these topics. Today we are joined by a good friend of ours, Dr. J. Bones Floatman. And Bones and I actually met over 20 years ago as we were being introduced to how to fly fighters. So we are very excited. Bones, before he became a fighter pilot, was a flight surgeon. And not just a flight surgeon. He was the flight surgeon for the United States Air Force demonstration team, the Thunderbirds. So that lets you know the caliber of doctor that we're dealing with here. And that just wasn't enough, being a flight surgeon for Bones, so he decided to go to pilot training. So he resigned his commission as a. As a doctor, joined the line of the Air Force, went to pilot training, and rocked the entire program to the point that he got the aircraft of his choice, which was the F15C. I flew the F15E and we met as we were both learning how to fly the, just the basic fundamentals of fighters in the T38. So from there he, you know, through the Air Force career, ends up becoming a flying doctor. So he goes back and gets recertified. However that is if you. We may get to that, Bones, but gets back to being a doctor and a pilot. Now ends up being on some teams that were dealing with the US Air Force's hypoxia issues and with that, ended up going to fly the world's leading fifth generation fighter, the F22. So we've got an F15C F22 Pilot Doctor, and retired a few years ago and has been a practicing doctor ever since. So, Bones, welcome to the dust in my podcast, man. [00:04:05] Speaker A: Hey, this is my pleasure. I was so excited to see that you guys were doing this. And the theme of what you're doing is everything that I believe. And it hit me so close to home. So when we reconnected, I was so excited to, to get the invitation and then more excited to find out what you guys are actually doing because it's, it's really important. And I think this time in our history, I mean, you know, I think God puts us in places at the right time, with the right people and with the right opportunities. And you guys are really, I would say, just shining the light that I'd like to, to follow. And, and I'm so happy to be here. [00:04:48] Speaker B: Cool. Thank you. That's awesome. [00:04:50] Speaker C: Hey, Jay, your career kind of, kind of like a movie. It's kind of like a movie script, you know, but you know, what would you say is crazier? It's why is that 22 raptor or trying to convince the American people about the nutritional situation in this country? [00:05:07] Speaker A: Oh my gosh. You hit the nail on the head, right? I mean, you would think that flying a Raptor is super difficult. And, and the problems that we dealt with were extreme. In fact, I remember sitting in a, in a brief and we had a retired four star general that was kind of giving us the lowdown. He's like, look, if we don't find out what's going on with this airplane, this is going to be the most expensive airplane on a stick. And I'm like, ooh, well, we better get to work. But, but I have to say though, to answer your question, when you're really looking at the health of our nation, the health of our world and in our communities, it is a problem that has been decades in the making, right? And it's only People like you and I, I think, that have really kind of taken the ball now. We are seeing some changes, I hope, nationally. But my goodness, you know, I can. I can go back and tell you, you know, during medical school and during my medical training and my medical experience, we really didn't talk about the things that you guys are talking about. We didn't talk about the things that I believe and that I'm passionate about now. So the bigger problem, the harder problem to solve, I think that's yet to be seen. But I think you can. You can already tell we've got the F22 back in here. Right? [00:06:38] Speaker B: I mean. Right. [00:06:40] Speaker A: That problem is solved, but our problem that we're talking about is not. So I think that kind of answers the question from my perspective. [00:06:49] Speaker B: Well, I. Yeah, yeah. We're right there with you. [00:06:52] Speaker C: We're right there with you. My goodness. Yeah. [00:06:54] Speaker B: So I didn't know and was very interested to find out you are from somewhere near us. [00:07:04] Speaker A: So I found out your farm was in Missouri. I'm like, no kidding? I was born in Missouri. My dad, you know. Well, actually, I need to say it, right? Missouri. That's right. Every time we talk about it, he corrects me. I still have family there. I have family. And my mom's family was from Poplar Bluff, you know, down at the southern border near Arkansas. And then my other cousin lives in Columbia, and one lives in Kansas City. So I've got people all over the place. [00:07:34] Speaker C: They're down there in the Sunshine State, where we're from. So we've kind of done a swap. [00:07:38] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, I. I kind of think that it's neat because you guys are, you know, right in the heartland. [00:07:49] Speaker C: Yes, we are. [00:07:51] Speaker A: I'm in the redneck Riviera. [00:07:52] Speaker C: Oh, that's right. Yeah, that is right. [00:07:56] Speaker B: So how do you go from born in Missouri to, I want to be a doctor? And not just a doctor. A doctor in the military. And not just that, you know, a flight surgeon for the Thunderbirds, and then now a fighter pilot. Like, how do you. What's that dream look like? [00:08:16] Speaker A: It is. Well, that is a great question, because it didn't start as my dream. In fact, my dad moved us to Texas so he could. He's a veterinarian, so he. He found some other work there in Texas. So we. We moved there when I was probably seven. And then being a veterinarian, I wanted to do something medical. So he's like, well, don't be a veterinarian. They don't make any money. Go be A go be a doctor. So I'm like, oh, okay, might as well try that. So I, you know, went to medical school and I'm like, how am I going to pay for this? So then I was like, well, you know, the military might be an option. So I became an Air Force reservist and then got a scholarship in that fashion. But let me just give you some backdrop. No exposure to military. No exposure to the Air Force. No exposure to airplanes. Really. [00:09:12] Speaker B: So, yeah, me too. [00:09:14] Speaker A: I was like, okay. So I start my career after medical school. I go to training in pediatrics in the Air Force Keesler Air Force Base. And during that year, loved the families, loved the kids, loved the relationships. But I was like, man, this medicine, it's not really, you know, turning me on. So my friend who I went to med school with actually went to the academy and he's like, why don't you be a flight surgeon? So I'm like, okay, what's that? You know, and he tells, tell me about it. And we go down to San Antonio for our training and I get one, one flight in a P37 trainer. And if you remember, I mean, that I. That plane, I've never been exposed to and never heard about it. I didn't even have a flight suit. So I get in there, my BDUs is what we had back then. [00:10:10] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:10:11] Speaker A: And we do one incentive flight. And I was like, this is the funnest thing I've ever done. I really had such a great time that I'm like, huh, I wonder if there are any, you know, flight surgeons that actually fly. And I just started reading, you know, or listening and, and asking. And I found out about the small program in the Air Force, the pilot physician program. I called the director and he's like, well, you know, honestly, the, the way that people normally do this is they are pilots first and they go back to medical school, blah, blah, blah. And I just kept in contact. And over time, somebody actually about a year before me that was a flight surgeon kind of broke the code and got accepted as an active duty officer to pilot training. And I, and then, you know, there was some stuff going on in my personal life at that time where I, where I was doing my one year gig as a flight surgeon in Tampa and I was looking for other options and the Thunderbird message came out. And I'm like, literally, I'm like, oh, what's this? [00:11:24] Speaker C: That's great. [00:11:25] Speaker A: Didn't even know who they were. I mean, I literally wrote, I think on my application, you know, you Write a personal statement. The red, white and blue smoke of the Thunderbird. And I was like, wait a minute. They don't even have red. They don't have blue. You know, I didn't even know that, so. Well, the beauty of it is, I think there were just a limited pool to select from because we all went out for an interview. And I just. I don't know, I just got along with the guys. I. I really had a good time. And I thought, well, this is. This would be a great opportunity. And I continued, you know, putting in the application process, and lo and behold, got the word and. And Vegas bound after one year as a flight docket McDill, and having only had one F16 ride and one F15 ride and both of which I was like, oh, man, this is awesome. But I didn't feel so great. [00:12:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:29] Speaker A: So I wonder how this is going to all play out and then get to Vegas and really had a great time. I went. We went obviously all over the world, all over the country. Got to fly in the backseat, got to experience. I actually flew most of my sorties as a flight surgeon with the aggressors. So it was all air to air. Loved that mission. And I thought, well, this is. This is awesome. I want to try to do that. So I just called my functional at the personnel center and said, hey, I've only got about six months left of my commitment. What do you think about me applying to pilot training? She said, if you get accepted, I'll let you go. [00:13:09] Speaker B: Oh, nice. [00:13:10] Speaker A: And 10 years later, you know, after they kind of got me, I was stuck. [00:13:17] Speaker C: So just real quick, because some of our listeners might not know, can you describe what the. The function is or what the job is for a, quote, flight dog for the Thunderbirds? [00:13:28] Speaker A: Yeah. So the job of flight doc. That is a great question, because everybody asked me, well, well, do you need it? Are you actually doing surgery on the airplane? I'm like, not really. So I asked the same question to my buddy, and what I found out, the best way to explain it is you're a primary care physician for the aviation community, and you're supposed to be the aeromedical expert in the airplane of your assignment. So what that means is you're supposed to give the medical, environmental perspective of the plane that you're assigned to. So in my case, I was assigned to a fast jet, a fighter. So I'm supposed to be the aeromedical expert in that cockpit environment. Right. [00:14:23] Speaker C: Okay. [00:14:24] Speaker A: And I think that even that. And. And this may. If there's Ever. Any flight docs that hear this, it, this may step on a few toes, but unfortunately the training is good. Right. And I'm sure it's gotten a lot better. But it's limited because we are in such a dire shortage of flight surgeons that we have to get people out to the field as soon as possible. So our exposure is limited. But more importantly, I think what's missing in the flight doc's mind and in his perspective is the operation of that weapon system. Because what I learned and Psycho can back me up on this, getting in a weapon system is more than flying the plane. I mean, that's the kind of the, I think the, the Ms. Misnomer that a flight surgeon has is that they're the expert when they really don't know how to operate the weapon system. And the human part of that is completely different than going from A to B, take off and landing. [00:15:30] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, right. [00:15:31] Speaker A: So it wasn't until I really got introduced to what it is to be a pilot and then later to operate the weapon system that you develop that human factors expertise. The man machine interface, which I think was paramount in the F22 because. Because listen, that was a single seat only from start to finish. Never had there been a medical person fly that airplane. [00:16:01] Speaker C: Wow. [00:16:02] Speaker A: I mean, there have been like physiologists that were part of the early program, but in, but operating the aircraft. And there's a difference between getting in the simulator. Oh yeah, you know this, right. I mean, you can go out and do a tactical mission in the simulator and have no fear. [00:16:20] Speaker B: Right, Exactly. [00:16:22] Speaker A: So that, that difference right there separates the, the real life environment from the simulated environment. Because your heart rate may not go up, your adrenaline may not spike, your. All those sympathetic and parasympathetic nerves don't get activated. And so, you know, the whole piccolo that you play, the, the interface of this particular part of the airplane compared to not hitting the ground is a, is a concert that doesn't happen in the sim. That is essential and required in the air. [00:16:56] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:16:56] Speaker C: Pilots are, and a lot of people might not know this, but fighter pilots in particular, they are and I would consider an elite athlete. Their bodies are subjected to G forces and speeds. And that, that interface that you were just talking about, what was it like just being responsible for those elite performers and making sure that their bodies were performing. [00:17:23] Speaker A: Yeah. So this is, this is kind of the stepping stone that led me into what you guys are, are now really preaching. And that is human performance and health and fitness. But more importantly, the, the connection that we have to whatever it is that we're doing. So performance can be flying an aircraft. It can be teaching a kindergarten class. Right. Because those, those folks will drive me nuts. But it can for sure. Yeah. It can vary on what you're doing, your performance, your activities tied to your overall well being. So flying in a jet puts you in an environment that's unlike any other environment. There is no workspace environment that's like that. [00:18:05] Speaker B: Right. [00:18:06] Speaker A: The G forces, you can experience some of those when you go out and ride a roller coaster or when you do specific things that are kind of for fun. But if you're trying to operate a multimillion dollar machine under those forces, using your brain, your body together and try to process the information mentally that the airplane's giving you, it is a completely unique environment. So how do we prepare and really fuel that man or woman to operate in that environment? And that's kind of the crux of, of human performance in aviation, because even an airliner is going to be taxed with different things. So I think that over time you get introduced to that, like in that school that I told you about, the training, you even get introduced to that in some pilot training, like we go through some physiology courses, you know, we kind of learn a little bit about the human body and its response to those environments. But to really dive deep into both and then how do we optimize that performance is kind of boils down to real simple stuff that you guys are talking about every day. You know, what goes on our fork, what we do with our fingers, what we do with our feet, and then for me personally, how we interact with our faith, you know, how does our faith play into all that? And I'm a big proponent of the mind body connection and using faith. And for me, it's the Christian faith that I so dearly hold on to. So it really helps me try to put it all together. But it's very simple when it comes to performance. [00:19:53] Speaker C: Yeah, I love that I saw your four Fs, your effort, feet, fingers, I love it, I really do. And that's, it's a lot of what we do talk about and we've talked with our children about, you know, that those simple things that we as humans, you know, are affected by all those little touch points. [00:20:15] Speaker B: Yeah. For US we picked three Fs. Food, Freedom and Farming. But. Right, get the fourth one, you know. [00:20:22] Speaker A: Freedom, I mean, God take. Boy, did we take that for granted. [00:20:26] Speaker C: Yeah, right. [00:20:28] Speaker A: Holy. [00:20:29] Speaker B: For sure. Yeah. So now why transition to fighter pilot then from, from flight Surgeon. [00:20:37] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:38] Speaker B: To fighter pilot. Like, what, what, what happened there? Was it, was it gonna be. [00:20:43] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm gonna be really. This is gonna be. I don't know, this is pretty funny, but sitting in my office, right. I would have these weird, you know, Nellis, Las Vegas, the home of the fighter pilot. Right. So most of my clientele was the fighter community. Right. And who do I see in the fighter community besides the pilots? I see their families. And who do I see in their families? I see the wives and I'm like, dang, man, these guys have the hottest wives there. So even, even in my, you know, my squadron with the Thunderbirds, I'm like, man, I got to do this. That is going to be the key. Apparently you got to be a fighter pilot to have a good looking life. So. [00:21:34] Speaker B: Well, it worked for both of us, I tell you. [00:21:37] Speaker A: It works for me too. Yeah. Yeah. So that was that. I mean, that aside, I really just liked what you said earlier. The elite athletic performance. So I'm five foot nothing, I weigh 150 nothing. But I played sports growing up. I loved participating in competitive sports, even though I was not, you know, technically the picture of an athlete, but I, I always considered myself an athlete. And then when I got in a jet, I'm like, ooh, that's an athletic performance. And then as time went on and you, you kind of hinted at it, how do we keep that mentality of, hey, we are, we're professional athletes. Right. And psycho. You know this. We weren't always treated that way. We weren't looked. [00:22:31] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:31] Speaker A: That way. But more importantly, our support wasn't designed in the Air Force to optimize that, that system of belief. [00:22:44] Speaker C: Right. [00:22:44] Speaker A: We had some things that we were supposed to do, you know, kind of physically. [00:22:48] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:22:49] Speaker A: And we had kind of some tests that were supposed to determine whether or not we could perform under that environment. But we never really had a proactive, prescriptive program that was going to pursue excellence as an athlete. [00:23:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:08] Speaker A: And I mean, there, you know, I'll tell you a story about that as we go, but my decision was basically a combination of, hey, I'm, I like using my brain, but I also like playing sports. So this was a great marriage of those two things. [00:23:24] Speaker B: Yeah, that's really cool. So at, at some point, if I, I think I was looking through some of the stuff that you have online, I believe it may have been while you were at school in dc, you, you had sort of a revelation, awakening that, an awakening that really, and we've mentioned it before on, on the podcast I've. I talked about a friend of mine that really introduced us to keto and the ketogenic lifestyle. I noticed you posting that kind of stuff, I don't know, back 2017, 18, and by 19 is when we said, we're going to do this, we're going to try it. But I had seen you posting about it for a while. So tell us about what happened. [00:24:13] Speaker A: So, yes, here's the thing. You know, going through medical school, going through all the sports I played when I was younger, going through all of that growing up, even call it everything that I had experienced up to that point, it was a simple, I just need fuel, right? It didn't matter where it came from. I just needed fuel and I looked at food that way. Medical school, we never talked about nutrition even, even in college, you know, if you take a nutrition class, you talk about it, you learn about it, you read the textbook and such, but you, I don't think you process it to the point that you're going to make or implement, excuse me, changes in your life. So what happened was there. I was. No, I was interested. I'd always been a kind of an entrepreneur at heart. You know, I'd always had other interests. So I was involved in, in several different things. Even while on active duty, I would participate with supplements, and I even got involved with some companies that were representing different supplements. And I had a colleague reach out to me and he's like, hey, Jay, what do you know about ketones? And clearly my mind was, I think biased is the best word to use from that word. Going back to medical school. And my response was, it's a path. It's the result of a pathologic state. Because what was I thinking about keto? Exactly? I was like, I think the same. [00:25:48] Speaker B: We all have the same, the same basic. It's like, oh, no, that's bad. [00:25:52] Speaker A: That's bad. Yeah. In fact, I, it was a bad word, right? So you kind of get this in your brain that ketones are bad. And I, I responded that way. And he's like, no, I'm not talking about dka, diabetic ketoacidosis, I'm talking about ketones. And I'm like, well, what do you mean? And here's what's really crazy. And again, I think it's a God wink about that same time. I'm not kidding you. I was in a medical seminar and part of. So I went to the National Defense university there in D.C. at Fort McNair, and I was part of the Eisenhower School. And so I was there in a, in a medical seminar and we were talking about traumatic brain injury. And at that point, you know, we were seeing a lot of the soldiers coming back and, and sailors and airmen coming back with injuries that were nondescript, vague. A lot of the times they were mentally mental related or, you know, they were kind of deficits that weren't specific, but they were, they were very similar. How's that? So the difficulty was the diagnostic criteria. How do we determine this is a TBI when there are so varied or a myriad of, of symptoms? Moreover, how do we determine a treatment protocol? Right. So there were two main problems. And our, our lecturer that day was from the traumatic. Oh, he was the traumatic brain tbi. He was at the Army Research lab and he was the head of the TBI department. And we were discussing, you know, that difficulty. And one of my colleagues, an Army Medical Service Corps officer, he said, well, have you heard of Ops Fuel? Are you looking at anything else that's kind of out there, that's not traditional? He said, we are entertaining, you know, non traditional mechanisms of treatment. But I haven't heard of that. And, but my background as pilot, now I'm like, oh, that's, that's a neat name. What's that all about? So I reached out to, to him and he connected me with his colleague. And essentially it was another msc, I believe, that had retired and had partnered with a, a new business model. And it was called Ops Fuel and they were a startup. And I just got like a two page PDF and it was full of research articles. And I don't know if you guys have heard or have researched in your, your background whenever that conversation started. A guy named Richard Veeck. [00:28:38] Speaker C: No, I don't know that one. [00:28:40] Speaker A: Oh, man. Let me. So I'm gonna show you a book, this book. [00:28:47] Speaker C: Wow. [00:28:48] Speaker B: Okay. [00:28:49] Speaker A: So it's called Ketones, the fourth fuel. [00:28:52] Speaker C: Yep. [00:28:54] Speaker A: And it's written, it's written by Travis Christopherson, but it goes through a history from, and these name, these names might actually be more familiar. Warburg. [00:29:08] Speaker B: Yes, sure. [00:29:10] Speaker A: To Krebs. [00:29:11] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:12] Speaker A: To Veech. [00:29:14] Speaker B: Wow. [00:29:14] Speaker A: That's the one you don't know. So the guy's name was Richard Veach. He worked at nih. [00:29:20] Speaker B: Okay. [00:29:21] Speaker A: When it was still a good organization. Right. So he was working at nih. He was contracted by darpa, okay. To develop a super fuel for operators. And essentially what he was trying to do is develop a supplement that operators could take in the field that was small, that was portable, that was effective, and it avoided the post sugar dump. [00:29:52] Speaker C: And what year was that? Did you say? [00:29:54] Speaker A: Oh, geez. Back probably. Probably 80s, 90s, maybe. [00:30:00] Speaker C: Okay, okay. [00:30:02] Speaker A: But so what's crazy is some of those articles were written by him, and what he had developed was a ketone ester. And my buddy who brought this conversation to me was involved in a company that had a ketone salt. So this is how all this conversation started. Yeah, I just dove into the research, and then I started reading, and I even called Richard Veech, and he was an old man at this point, still at the nih. I talked to him about his articles, and we just had a conversation. And, you know, that is what really changed my mind into this conversation and, and trying to understand the fuel sources. Remember I said my original, you know, impression of food was fuel? [00:30:55] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:30:56] Speaker A: Regardless. And even my wife will tell you, for whatever reason during that time, this is how God works. He. Somehow she started to eat more low carb, and she started feeling better. She started losing weight. She started cooking that way, even though I was like, oh, I'm. I'm a carbolicious, you know, carboholic. Give me all the carbs I can. It wasn't until the combination of the confluence of all of those things happening that I, I said, wait a minute, something's up here. And then it was during that same, you know, year in that seminar later where I really started to think what you guys probably believe in, which is chronic disease mitigation and using simple things. And that's when I really started to read about, okay, how sick are we? [00:31:53] Speaker C: Wow. [00:31:54] Speaker A: You know, we're. [00:31:55] Speaker C: Wow, sick. [00:31:56] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, you said it. And then I did a paper while, While at ndu, and I called it Sugar the New Heroin. And that led me to research, you know, statistics. Right on. From, you know, cdc from. Even from the national security perspective. Because, you know, our. Our military federal budget is an. A discretionary part of our funding, and so is Medicare and Medicaid. And if you look at the projections that I was looking at back then, and this was in 2015, Medicare, Medicaid, we're going to basically push out your. Your DOD budget because we were. We were entering the slope of the curve where those two buckets, if you will, were becoming larger of the whole bucket. And keep in mind, discretionary is a finite bucket. [00:33:02] Speaker B: Right. [00:33:03] Speaker A: And what constituted the most of those two spending fuel funnels. Chronic disease, you know, diabetes, cardiovascular disease, obesity, cancer. The big ones that we all hear about. Then peeling back the onion, literally, you know, where do you find the. The root cause of Most of that is lifestyle. And that's kind of. Yeah. What, what led me to really think, well, how can I. What can I do first in my own life, in my family's life? But more importantly, how do I adopt this as a physician and then combining the two disciplines, how do I use this to try to educate my fellow athletes on how to perform? [00:33:56] Speaker C: So sugar as the new heroine, what were some of the major, major takeaways out of that paper? [00:34:04] Speaker A: Yeah, here's one. There was an experiment done with mice. The mice were given heroin and the mice were given sugar. And the bottom line was the, the mouse that was given sugar was more addicted to the sugar than they were to heroin. [00:34:22] Speaker C: Wow. [00:34:22] Speaker A: And I was like, oh, my gosh. The other one was sugar. Right? Calories. Yes. But more importantly, thinking about the nutritional value, it's actually a negative. It costs more for you to process a simple sugar than it does giving you. Does that make sense? [00:34:44] Speaker C: Yes. And that's one of the nutritional myths that we fight today is the calorie is a calorie that was brought on by corporations like Coca Cola in order to defend their products. A calorie is a calorie. And the fact that the, the sugar is actually negative. [00:35:03] Speaker A: Yeah, that was one of the eye openers in that paper that I, I recognized that. Wait a minute. It's not only, you know, kind of negligible, it's negative. It costs more to try to utilize it. So, you know, then, then the next thing you know, I mean, do we really have to have it nutritionally? And that, that started a whole another, you know, branch of my, I guess, research. Yeah, I mean, what do you guys think? Do you. Do you absolutely have to have sugar? [00:35:39] Speaker B: Oh, no, we, we certainly know you do not. [00:35:42] Speaker C: Well, we ate. We ate a carnivore lifestyle after, after our keto journey started in 2019, February, when he came to me and said, I really want to try this or autoimmune type things. I really want to try this. And of course I was reluctant, but we do everything together. So down the path we went and it. Then we got to the point we were quite entrenched into ketogenic lifestyle and I heard about carnivore and so in order, just for. As an experiment for researching for my. Another family member, mental health problems, like, hey, could this help? Is it sustainable? Can we do this? We used ourselves as a bit of a lab rat. [00:36:30] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:36:30] Speaker C: And we went Carnivore for almost 15 months. [00:36:34] Speaker A: Wow. [00:36:34] Speaker C: We did not have one carbohydrate. [00:36:36] Speaker A: Oh my Gosh, that's dispute of. [00:36:40] Speaker B: Yeah, no, we, I mean, we have. [00:36:41] Speaker C: Dairy and we had some meat and dairy. Meat and dairy and some, some spices and that's what we ate for 15 months. So, yes, there's some carbohydrates in dairy, but we didn't eat not much. There was no sugar, there was no, no nothing. [00:36:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:36:58] Speaker C: So for sure it is not required. [00:37:02] Speaker A: Your body does, you know, it's a beautiful thing. [00:37:04] Speaker B: It is. [00:37:05] Speaker A: I think God made it. I mean, clearly you can see the intelligent design behind it. He. If we need glucose, the liver will make it. [00:37:12] Speaker B: It's just amazing. Isn't. Really is. [00:37:15] Speaker C: It's gorgeous. [00:37:17] Speaker B: We were talking about it in our recent travels, but like, I had, I had never heard of ketones and I had. I certainly didn't know that there was an alternative fuel source that your body could run on, and I didn't know that your brain could use ketones. And I like this, this. The. You think by the time you get to be an adult, you've probably heard all of the things that they're. I mean, you know, you may hear something that you haven't heard of before about your body, but like there's a whole different fuel source that your body can use. Was. It really did floor me like a. I, I really don't know much. [00:37:57] Speaker A: Yeah, no, I agree. I, I think that what I found was that I think the general perspective, including my own, was that ketones are going to be only produced in a negative situation like starvation or you're going to fast, both of which have negative connotations. But if you, if you read the word fasting was part of the relationship building with your faith, you know. [00:38:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:38:29] Speaker A: And, and the beauty of it is that when you fast or if you adopt some fasting protocols, you tap into those ketones, they actually are more beneficial fuel. They're. You know, the way I used to explain it is it uses less oxygen and it produces more ATP, which is that cellular currency of energy, about 30 to 35% on each case. You're going to use about 30% less oxygen to produce and you're going to generate about 30% more ATP. So win. Win. Right. And it has no negative connotation. And I started, you know, kind of reaching out to experts in the field. There's another guy you may have heard of called Dominic D'Agostino. [00:39:21] Speaker C: Yeah. [00:39:21] Speaker B: Yes. [00:39:23] Speaker A: A PhD type. So I connected with him and we exchanged some, some emails and, and I read a lot of his stuff and the guy's a beast. Right. And and he was really doing high performance heavy lifting while low carb, which is. It's kind of contrary to what you expect. [00:39:49] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. Yeah. So one of the things that we've talked about. I don't. This was several years ago. Our second oldest daughter, her. Her. Her call sign is Hale. She's currently in the. In the bowlers in the 492nd and sitting in the front seat. Yeah. And one of the things that psycho over here told her was, I'm going to tell you right now, if I was doing it over again, if I had every day to fly again, I would fly it in ketosis. Because I cannot imagine as. As good as you guys are, as good as you were at your jobs or are still at your job, the. The magnitude of better performance that there would have been with mental clarity and your body firing on with. With ketones versus, I don't know, beer and popcorn. [00:40:47] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, you said it. What was our standard fighter pilot sticker Bars. Yeah. And then walking every. Every Friday at the ops desk. What was waiting for us? Donuts. Right? Donuts. So I'm gonna go fuel with donuts and coffee and then go fly a surge. BFM Sortie. [00:41:06] Speaker B: Yep. [00:41:07] Speaker C: She finally listen. [00:41:09] Speaker B: Yeah. And then you crash and you're like. [00:41:11] Speaker A: Oh, my gosh, I feel so bad. Yeah. [00:41:14] Speaker B: Right, right. [00:41:16] Speaker C: So she finally listened and she is a carnival. [00:41:19] Speaker A: She's. [00:41:19] Speaker C: She eats carn. [00:41:20] Speaker A: Really? She's flying. [00:41:22] Speaker C: Yeah. And like in tip top mental and physical performance with that. Those dietary ways of eating information with her colleagues. [00:41:35] Speaker B: Yeah. They think she's crazy. Yeah. All you're gonna eat is that meat, you know? Yeah. I'm gonna add some butter to it, you know, like. Oh, yeah, yeah. [00:41:47] Speaker C: They think she's crazy, but there's a couple that have come around, and there are a couple that are kind of doing that also now. So I think it might be slowly having a little bit of influence on some of her. [00:41:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:41:59] Speaker C: Comrades. [00:42:00] Speaker A: Well, you know what I started seeing and you. You know this. I goes, we fighter pilots, their bodies are broke. I mean, I saw it from two sides. Right. I saw it from the guys coming in. My last time I was at Langley. So if I was ever in flight medicine, I get all the retire, you know, the guys approaching retirement, and they were. They were just broken necks, backs. All their spinal processes were inflamed. Some had slipped disc, some had neurological. I mean, all kinds of stuff. Right. And I'm like, man, we have got to prevent this from happening. And. And so that's kind of when I Started to explore the prevention side of things. And, and, and using a fuel source like ketones can actually be anti inflammatory. Learning about that, and I'm like, man, we got to talk about this. And it was kind of funny. After I retired, you know, I flew Eagles and Raptors with the guy that was the squadron commander out here at Tyndall for the triz, the training squadron. And he calls me up, he said, hey, Bones. And he knew this already. You know anybody that would be interested in talking to the new B core students that have 22 students about nutrition and sleep and stress management? I was like, oh, really? I do know somebody like that. And so he actually allowed me to submit a contract proposal for one of their human factors courses. And so for a solid probably three years, I was part of their B course syllabus. [00:43:40] Speaker B: Oh, nice. [00:43:41] Speaker A: Yeah, so I did kind of a half day with them and we talked about nutrition, we talked about exercise, we talked about sleep, and we talked about stress management and, and human performance. And it was all under the umbrella of something that you'll appreciate called optimizing the human weapon system. So, you know, that, that was a program that while I was on the staff at Langley, we, we coined and we started because I don't know if you, I mean, you know this. The, the army and special ops throughout the services have embedded sometimes trainers, and they have physical therapists, they have strength and conditioning coaches, they even have, some of them have psychologists. So they, they have a whole human approach. And I think they do that because they know they're like you said, elite athletes, right? They're, they're at the top of their performance spectrum and they're going to support that. And so I'm like, wait a minute. Fighter pilots in that community also need something like that. So we started putting together a program. And I'm like, what are we going to call this? And I'm like, what is that? What's it called in the F15, you know that house? The Overlord Overload Warning System. [00:45:15] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah, that's right. [00:45:18] Speaker A: So we're going to name it. So cool. Yeah, we started, and now literally, if you go anywhere, if you go to Seymour today, they have an Aloes program that's established where they have their own aviators gym and fitness building. In fact, I fly out of Kingston supporting Seymour. Yeah, I've been over to Seymour, to the Owls Strength and Conditioning center. And you know, they got whole staff and dude, it is, it's fed, it's, it's leaked into all of the combat air forces. Throughout. [00:45:52] Speaker B: That's great. [00:45:53] Speaker A: Forms. Yeah. [00:45:54] Speaker B: So why bones? If. If ketones and ketosis and you. You increase mental clarity, you decrease inflammation. Like, we could talk for, you know, an hour about all of the benefits of being in ket. Why? Why what? Why isn't it just. Everybody's doing it. Like, why wouldn't you just. If we all know that it's better and we all know that it's great and we. There are all these benefits. Like, is there. Is there some type of. From. So give me aviation and medical perspective. Is there a pushback somewhere? Is somebody saying that this is not true? Like, am I. Or Shelley and I and you, are we quacks? I mean, like. [00:46:45] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:46:45] Speaker C: Why would. [00:46:46] Speaker B: Why would people not do this? [00:46:49] Speaker A: Well, I think you kind of, you. You touched on it. It's difficult, right? It is a. It takes us. It takes purpose and discipline to make those choices. And you know this as well. So I hate to say this, but it is a funding issue from it cost. Carbs are so cheap. [00:47:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:47:12] Speaker A: And you and I can go to the store and we can load up on processed cheap food. And the majority of it is sugar laden, carb heavy. And I think that's kind of bled over into the industry writ large. Food industry, medical industry, pharmaceutical industry, athletic industry, period. So that, I think is the first hurdle. Just the, the nature of, you know, the discipline to make those choices, the opportunity to. To have access to those things that will allow us to do that. But I think there's also clear bias because it's been this way, like I said at the very beginning, for decades. You know, we've kind of put. Painted ourselves into a square corner. Here goes all the way back. I talked about this when I was briefing those kids. Started with the seven country study. [00:48:14] Speaker B: We've talked about Ansel quite a bit on the podcast. [00:48:16] Speaker A: Oh my gosh, man. And I. Yeah, I just introduced that. And hey, he was telling us that fat is bad and that it's going to clog your arteries with this cholesterol. And then come to find out he just cherry picked some data, presented it to the government and they accepted it. And. And then, you know, they just went to their donors and, you know, whatever. So then you just get the whole. Decades later, you know, when you're watching the Six Million Dollar man from when we were. When I was a kid. [00:48:50] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. [00:48:51] Speaker A: Everybody's standing, you know. Yeah. Today. And you're just watching TV and you're like, oh, man. [00:48:58] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:48:59] Speaker A: What have we done to ourselves? So, you know, that's the first hurdle. But I think, you know, the second hurdle is just the bias that creates thinking that, oh man, you guys don't know what you're talking about. You got to have carbs to perform. [00:49:14] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:49:14] Speaker C: A lot of the thing too, that we see even amongst our friends is, well, my doctor says, oh, yeah, golly. Well, and that's a hard one to fight. Again, whenever you're right, you hear your friends saying or your family members saying, well, my doctor said X. Yeah. And the studies over here show that it's not the case, actually. And to combat nutritional and actual health science against what a doctor says, that's, that's a, that's a steep hill to climb. [00:49:56] Speaker B: We've taken a few comments pointed at us on the podcast along that same vein, like, are you a doctor? Okay, then you just should shut up. [00:50:05] Speaker C: Sure. [00:50:05] Speaker B: You know, you know, it's like, oh, man, you're. [00:50:09] Speaker A: That's. Well, I'm gonna say this because I appreciate that because in 2015, when the, when I was still at NDU, right prior to me having that aha moment, I would be briefing incoming students as the command surgeon for ndu, and I talked about, you know, hey, what does your lipid profile look like? Eating low fat. And I, I preached that because that's what I was taught, guys. I mean, you know, that's what I was taught. And I stopped reading or if I read, I took the one liners. I actually didn't look at it. I didn't get any other perspectives. So I adopted that as truth. And truth is a very sometimes difficult thing to find. And, and here's what we've seen over the last five years is that truth is objective, but some people try to make it objective or subjective and it bends and then hearsay gets adopted as truth. So you really have to do some reading. And I think you have done what I like to see in my patients, which is, hey, we're going to develop this relationship, we're going to educate each other. I may have a little bit more specialized training, but you can still read, you can still think, Right. And we can discuss what you've read. We can interact with a common foundation that I may give to you based on my background, and then we can come to a consensus on how this is going to affect your health. So I think that what I've learned is that people like you guys that may not have the medical training have educated themselves right on what those, what those documents say, how to interpret that in the context of what it means to me. [00:52:12] Speaker B: Right. [00:52:12] Speaker A: And unfortunately, just pushing those papers back at the doctor, I, I would say the majority of the time they haven't read it. Number one, they'll have that preconceived bias like I did because I had to read a lot over these last five years to try to. [00:52:31] Speaker B: Yeah, us too. Sure. [00:52:33] Speaker A: Change. Yeah, change some of the, the, the attitude that I had. I mean, my gosh, man, the whole pandemic changed my whole perspective, you know, and. Yeah, and I love it when, when patients are sending me articles and saying, what does this mean? You know, how can I interpret that? And that gives me an opportunity to have these conversations. [00:52:58] Speaker B: So along those lines, you recently posted that we should on your Facebook page that we should go check out a podcast where Sean Ryan hosted Gary Breca. And we, we listened to the three and a half hour podcast and last week our podcast was like a 45 minute mashup of us talking about their podcast. Right. And one of the things that though, that we didn't broach on our podcast because I just hadn't studied up on it enough is something that Gary brought up. And I was hoping that you'd talk to us a little bit about the MTHFR gene mutation. And what is, what does it mean? It seems if you listen to Gary Breca, that it's an important thing that we should all be hearing or learning about. [00:53:48] Speaker A: Yeah. So I'm sure that at one point in med school we just, we talked about it because it's a genetic mutation. It's a problem with some people's ability to convert folic acid to folate. So it's a, it's a methylation. [00:54:09] Speaker B: Does that mean conversion? Is that all methylate means? [00:54:12] Speaker A: Yeah, it's sticking a methyl group on, on a particular thing, you know, back to organic chemistry. I think it's like CH3 or something. I don't remember that part. But it's, it's the inability to, to methylate folic acid, I believe is the, the basic understanding. But the long story short is those people that have that genetic mutation are prone to have a problem processing folic acid. And that's one of those essential things that we need. You know, in medical school we learn about prenatal vitamins, prenatal care. Mothers taking prenatal vitamins to help their fetus develop, specifically the, the neural tube. So the spinal cord, this, you know, the spinal canal and the brain, that's all connected. Right. And part of that neural tube development requires folate. And. [00:55:13] Speaker B: That whole process, the way like the prenatal Vitamins. The way that. That is, like, the way that we help that with is we prescribe prenatal vitamins that are high in folic acid. [00:55:25] Speaker A: Right. [00:55:26] Speaker B: If you have this gene mutation and you cannot actually process the folic acid, it tends to build up. [00:55:33] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:55:33] Speaker B: Become bad in your system. So not only are you not getting the folate. [00:55:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:55:39] Speaker B: You can't methylate it. You're also. It's building up and doing some bad things, right? [00:55:43] Speaker A: That's right. So, you know, fast forward probably heard about it. We heard about the importance. But fast forward now, and I'm. I'm having conversations with. With colleagues, a fighter pilot colleague that was going through some. Some issues back when the COVID vaccine mandate came out for the military. He was approaching, you know, retirement age, so he's like, hey, hey, Bones, can you help me? You know, I have a. I have this genetic mutation in my family. I know it has a risk. Now, see, this is what you just said. It has risks. Right. This mutation has risks that we don't talk about very much. You know, this particular individual was worried about the risk for clotting disorder. And we had been hearing in the news and elsewhere, if you actually paid attention and read some studies, that the COVID vaccine, the Spike protein in general, carried a risk for clotting. So micro clotting of the. The micro vascular. Sure. And so he's like, hey, you know, would you write me an exemption? I was like, yeah, absolutely. Long story short, they didn't approve it. He decided to retire. I had another patient reached out to me, and she had known she was also had the mutation, and her symptoms were already well established, so they were very vague. And she had been to multiple doctors that had described anything from. You know, it's sad because when. When a patient presents and they have these vague symptoms that are sometimes neurological, in other words, confusion, disorientation, maybe their balance is a little messed up. Maybe they're just not remembering things. They don't have the same kind of acuity that they used to. Sometimes that can lead a doc or a provider to think it's more mental related, like, oh, you might have some kind of mental problems like depression, anxiety. Whereas if you looked at her labs, you'll. You'll see that one of her values, homocysteine, is elevated. And it's very possible that she, you know, at first she thought she maybe had a deficiency called pernicious anemia, which is a B12, a vitamin B problem. After doing the pernicious anemia blood work, we weren't able to confirm that. So we kind of thought, well, maybe it's a MF or mutation problem, and we could maybe try supplementing with methylated supplements that already had been converted. And that's kind of how that. But what Breca. I mean, dude. I mean, come on. A friend of mine passed me that, and I swear, within the first 30, 15 to 30 minutes, I was like, oh, my gosh, everybody has to hear this. [00:58:42] Speaker C: Yeah, we were all dropped. [00:58:44] Speaker B: Yeah. On our. On our podcast thumbnail, we said, best podcast ever, question mark. You know, like, we. We. We were same way, jaw dropped. [00:58:54] Speaker A: I actually have listened to it now a second time and trying to figure out a way that I can take notes and listen at the same time. And it's just difficult because he has so many nuggets and so much great information that it is not only good for a medical guy to review, but it's good for the general public because he talks layman's terms a lot, a lot of time, but he also uses very, you know, medical terms because of his background. [00:59:21] Speaker B: Sure. [00:59:22] Speaker A: So I was really appreciative of all that. [00:59:26] Speaker B: But what I did an idea for you, Bones. You can actually, through YouTube, you can grab the transcript of the entire thing, and you can drop that into a file, like a PDF, and then upload that PDF to Chat GPT. And then you can ask Chat GPT to do anything you want to with that file. So you can pull out key details or, like, anything. [00:59:49] Speaker C: It. [00:59:49] Speaker B: It. Chat GPT will do anything for you. [00:59:51] Speaker A: Whoa. [00:59:52] Speaker B: So I. I had it do that. I actually dropped the transcript of that podcast into Chat GPT, and then we use that as a basis. Then that's how we built our podcast based off of. Based off of the things that we normally talk about and. And how it might fit in with our podcast. So you can. It's. It's very, very powerful for stuff like that. You don't. You don't have to take notes anymore. [01:00:20] Speaker A: Well, I didn't. I didn't recognize and realize how prevalent it was. I mean, I. I mentioned. [01:00:25] Speaker B: You guys mentioned that earlier, almost the gene mutation. Yeah, yeah. Gary talks about 44, I think, is what he said. We've. We've done some other research. We've seen 40. We've seen 50. We've seen that there's a heterozygous. [01:00:45] Speaker A: Form. [01:00:45] Speaker B: Of it and a homozygous. And, you know, one is maybe only 30%, and one may be as high as 70. And, like, there's a bunch of different numbers out there. But I think, I think an easy for us is somewhere around half. You know, like, I think that's, that's pretty nearly, you know, vague. But I mean like the. I, we can't find any numbers that really, that really would refute that to say somewhere around half of the population of the United States at least has this particular gene mutation. And not only do they not know about it, they've never heard of it. And the symptoms vary in such a manner that it's not like, oh well, you know, you have the, the SW and finger. So you have this gene mutation. Right. Like, I mean there's, there's so many different symptoms that are involved with it. And like you said, a, a diagnostics perspective. If you're not looking for it, man, that it. You're. They describe something else. Right. Like, you know, my, this is. Yeah. And so the, the way to find it is, is difficult, I think. So in order to know that you have it, it requires a genetic test where they are looking for this specific gene mutation. We've looked at it. It looks like if you get it as a standalone test, you can have that test done for about 150 bucks. A way to like, lead you in the right direction. You mentioned a homocysteine test, and that one is only about 20 bucks. And, and can be at least part of a normal, you know, go to your doctor and get some tests. Right. So for about 20 bucks and maybe covered even by insurance, a person could say, I am interested in having a homocysteine levels test. And then if it's elevated, that would point you in the direction of maybe look further into this gene mutation. [01:02:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:02:54] Speaker B: Am I, am I on base? [01:02:55] Speaker A: Yeah, I mean that's, that's pretty, pretty on base. I think that that's perfect. And I, I'm going to tell you though, I don't know what made you guys mad about his conversation of that point, but what made me mad was his discussion. Do you remember his discussion of enriched and fortified. [01:03:16] Speaker B: Oh yeah. [01:03:16] Speaker A: Products. I was like, oh, you've got to be kidding me. [01:03:19] Speaker C: So you've got half, nearly half of the population who cannot convert folic acid. And we're spraying everything and enriching and fortifying and it's. By the way, it's required currently. That may change. Who knows? It's currently required to be done. And all 45 of the people can't. [01:03:42] Speaker B: That is one of the times when. [01:03:43] Speaker A: We paused and you went and looked in your pantry. [01:03:47] Speaker B: Well, no, we just sort of yelled at each other. Yeah, you have to be, you know, like. You got to be kidding me. Like, again, you. A lot of the folks that we listen to and talk about, you know, the. If it's telling you it's healthy, it's probably not. You know, if it's saying enriched and fortified and all of these things, that means it's probably most likely been sprayed with folic acid. And if you are one of half of the country that can't process that, not only is it not healthy for you, it's the opposite. [01:04:19] Speaker A: Hello? Hello? [01:04:21] Speaker B: Man. [01:04:21] Speaker A: Right? [01:04:22] Speaker B: Yeah, that was. [01:04:23] Speaker A: Hey. You know, I'm like, you got to be kidding me. That's what that means. I'm like, I know. [01:04:32] Speaker C: The medical professionals, though. So when I grow. I didn't. I wanted to be a doctor when I grew up, but I was married to a fighter pilot. That made it real difficult. So. [01:04:41] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:04:42] Speaker C: But so I have. It's a passion of mine and to kind of hold the feet to the fire and all of that. Some dear friends of ours, he. The one he just mentioned, he was recently found out that he has the gene mutation to two different gene. The two. One of each, I guess, is what he actually has. And tried to get his mother to, you know, make an appointment. Hey, you might. Guys might want to check, because I'm. I do. So the likelihood is it's genetic, so one or both of you do as well. And so she contacted her doctor, asked for homocysteine test. You know, need to make an appointment. Her doctor tech messaged back through the portal. I'm sure her message back was quite literally a cut and paste from Aetna. Oh, yeah, that was her answer, too. [01:05:41] Speaker B: He. He read us. He read us the doctor's answer and said, what does that sound like to you? And I'm like, it sounds like a copy paste from something. And he's like, it absolutely is. He. He took it and dropped it into Google as a search, and it popped to the Aetna insurance website. It was word for word what the insurance company said about the gene mutation. [01:06:01] Speaker C: So our. Our. We say, surmise that she didn't know this. I don't know if this. She. This person, this physician or PA or whatever did not know the answer or did not know about the gene mutation. [01:06:17] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:06:17] Speaker C: And therefore, you know, did some quick searching, and that was the answer that came back. She's gonna get her the test. She didn't deny her the test. [01:06:27] Speaker A: Okay. [01:06:28] Speaker C: But the answer was very. This probably isn't your problem. We'll get you the test. But it's probably not that. [01:06:36] Speaker B: Yeah. Because that's what the insurance company said. Right, right. He's like, you know, yes, this happens, but it's typically not the answer to anything. [01:06:45] Speaker A: You know, wow. It's true. And, I mean, I can sometimes have a little bit of compassion for them because, you know, corporate medicine is just. It is a. It's just a. It's just like a machine. You know, get them in, get them out, get them in, get them out. These things called RVUs. Basically, you're just numbers management. It's kind of like the metrics that we used in the Air Force. Do we meet the green. The metric doesn't matter how we got there. Did we meet it? [01:07:18] Speaker C: Yeah. Right. [01:07:19] Speaker A: Yeah. It happens the same in medicine. So those people that, you know, answer to a boss. [01:07:28] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:07:28] Speaker A: Or a company or an insurance company, and that kind of, you know, is tying in the whole collusion with industry and medicine, pharmacy and gosh, government, unfortunately. Yeah. That's why I'm so glad you guys are doing what you're doing. You're outside of that and. Oh, yeah, yeah. [01:07:53] Speaker C: And, you know, we have compassion for them, too. They're overworked. It's hard to read everything. It's hard to know everything. But what we like to tell our listeners is, you know, you have to advocate for yourself. [01:08:03] Speaker A: Right. [01:08:04] Speaker C: You, like you said before, you know how to read, and if you hear something and it sparks curiosity. And that's why we pointed everyone as best we could that would listen to the podcast with Sean and Gary. [01:08:18] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:08:19] Speaker C: Was this might pique some interest in you. You may go, hey, wait. And go research that. And then, like you said, take that to your doctor and say, can we please work together on this and learn more about it? Because we don't know all of everything about the human body. We just don't. We still don't. It's a magnificent machine. But if we can continue to educate ourselves and advocate for ourselves and the patient and not walk in blindly and hope and pray that in the five minutes that this doctor gives me is going to diagnose and figure out all of my problems. You know, there are very high expectations on the medical community. [01:08:59] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:09:00] Speaker C: But we can help them. [01:09:03] Speaker A: There's a lot of. There's a lot of defensive medicine going on as well as, you know, because of the whole tort, you know, and legal things and. And unfortunately, it has become. I will. I will use cholesterol as an example. You know, people back se. Like he said, you know, I think he was talking about 30 years ago, 20 years ago, the cholesterol cutoff was like 260. And even before that, in the 60s, it was 300. [01:09:34] Speaker B: Right. [01:09:35] Speaker A: And over time number is just dropping. It's the same with fasting. Blood glucose keeps dropping. Yes. And I think about, well, what's the truth, data? Right back to the truth. What is the truth data? And it really makes me question what a role as a physician should be communicating to my patients on. Okay, I will tell them straight up, I don't like to chase numbers. We have to look at the whole picture of the risk that you have. You know, do you smoke? Do you have high blood pressure? Are you overweight? Well, those are maybe three things you might consider. Oh, and is your fasting blood glucose higher than we want? Okay, all of those together. Maybe we can start working on those. But if you're, you know, three of the four aren't an issue, and maybe your fasting blood glucose is a little high, do I need to treat them? Right? Yeah. [01:10:41] Speaker B: Right. [01:10:41] Speaker A: So it really kind of hit me up. Hit me personally, because, I mean, I'm gonna, you know, again, be transparent. I don't have, like, a regular doctor that I go to. So a lot of times I'll just self experiment maybe like you guys. [01:10:57] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:10:59] Speaker A: So I went ahead and did some blood work recently, and I got my A1C back, and it was. It was a little elevated compared to the last one I had about four years ago. And I'm like, dang, man, what's changed? Right? And what does that change mean? I think that was the question that I really wanted to know. So. So I'm sitting, sitting on this computer, and I'm like, okay, tell me about hemoglobin A1C. And I go back and find an article from 2008. And I read it. And when I read it, A1C was never, @ that time, not a diagnostic criteria for diabetes. It was helpful, but it wasn't necessarily a diagnostic criteria. And when they talked about it, they compared it to using that percentage to determine what your average daily fasting glucose would be over the course of about 90 days. Right, right. So that's kind of what we preach to people. Right. But do you know the difference between, let's say, 5.6% and 5.7%, how that affects your average daily blood glucose? No, it's literally the difference between 114 and 116. [01:12:30] Speaker C: Right. [01:12:32] Speaker A: But if. But if you look at that from a diagnostic criteria, that is the. That's the line. [01:12:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:12:38] Speaker A: 5.6, 5.7. You've crossed over right. When it's really a difference of two digits. And then this paper now here, that's the number I'm using for 20, 25, 5.7. This paper used numbers that ranged anywhere from 6.0 to 6.2 to 7.0. That's kind of a. Hey, this is when you have probable diabetes. And I'm like, how did that happen over the course of time. [01:13:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:13:14] Speaker A: And the conspiracy in me thinks we can generate more people on medicine if I lower that number. And I hate that. I hate thinking that way. [01:13:26] Speaker B: Sure. [01:13:28] Speaker C: Well, if you can't find another reason. [01:13:32] Speaker A: It makes me sick. Because you look at the mortality between those two numbers in this article from 2008, really wasn't saying a whole lot. [01:13:44] Speaker C: Very interesting. [01:13:45] Speaker A: I know. What do you make of that? So I'm kind of left with, yeah, man. [01:13:51] Speaker C: So metabolic disease, mutated genes, bad dietary guidelines going on. We're all sick. I mean, we're just sick people. We are. But you've been working with some cutting edge stuff. And I do believe that while we might be sitting in the valley of wellness in this nation, that there's hope. [01:14:16] Speaker A: I do too. [01:14:17] Speaker C: I think there is hope. And you. Some of the things that you've been working on, like Peptides. [01:14:23] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:14:24] Speaker C: And uncovering some of the new things that they're finding. Like, talk to us about peptides a little bit. [01:14:29] Speaker A: What. [01:14:30] Speaker C: What are they? And what. What good are they gonna. How are they gonna help us in our middle ageness? [01:14:37] Speaker A: I agree. Peptides. So I had heard about these back in 2015. My buddy who's a. He is a, A cross feet. A crossfit. He was kind of of. Of the 40 plus crossfit, like. But he was also a advanced nurse practitioner, independent provider. Right. So he's really into the, to the human performance arena. And he's, he's like, bones or no. Jay, have you heard of peptides? And I'm like, no, no, I don't know. Well, this was back then. And he started rattling off some. Some acronyms. I'm like, I don't know what that means. And I just kind of forgot about it. It. Right. But then I got another reintroduction, if you will, another podcast. Dr. Huberman. [01:15:27] Speaker B: Yes. [01:15:28] Speaker A: Huberman Labs. Yeah. So again, coincidental, Right. I'm working as a medical director for a men's health clinic here in Destin, and we offer some peptides. And. And that word was always a mystery to me, honestly. But I'd heard it before. I just didn't know how it Applied to health and human performance. And then I listened to a Huberman podcast about peptides specifically, and he just kind of re. Reminded me, wait a minute, we've been using peptides for decades. Guess what? The first peptide we. Insulin. Right. Holy cow. Insulin. So a peptide is just a branch chain of amino acids. Okay. Usually amino acids develop into proteins, but peptides can be kind of defined as a 40 or less combination of amino acids. 40 or less. Generally, anything above that, you're going to start talking about into complex proteins. And so insulin was the first, you know, kind of early peptide was used. Oh, okay, I know what a peptide is. And then you start hearing about Ozempic. [01:16:47] Speaker B: I was going to say the one we all hear about these days is semaglutide, or however you say it. [01:16:53] Speaker A: Semaglutide. [01:16:54] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:16:55] Speaker A: And then you've got tirzepatide, all these GLP.1 glucagon, like peptide. And they, they have different mechanisms of action, but they are peptides designed to do particular things. So that's kind of the. The definition of a chain of amino acids that are destined to function in a particular way. Insulin, clearly, to help metabolize glucose. And then these other ones are different. So lo and behold, I had, for my 20th anniversary, Candice got me a membership to the golf club here at Panama City. So I joined and I've been playing as much as I can, and I developed some just. It's called medial, so the inside epicondylitis. So it's. It's a joint issue. Right. Where you get inflammation from overuse. Clearly the answer is to stop using it so much. Stop doing that. It's like tennis elbow on the other side of the elbow. [01:18:01] Speaker B: Yeah, sure. [01:18:02] Speaker A: It's called golfers. [01:18:03] Speaker C: Golfer's elbow. [01:18:05] Speaker A: So I started taking Motrin, you know, all the standard flight doc stuff. [01:18:09] Speaker B: Vitamin M arrested it. [01:18:13] Speaker A: I even put a compression sleeve on it. I even got to the point where I took steroids, like straight up. Prednisone. [01:18:21] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:18:21] Speaker A: And it was killing me. I'm like, I'm gonna have to get an mri. What. What have I done here? And it was just happenstance that I got an email from a peptide company and they were introducing their services. And I reached out, talked to the operations manager. She is providing me with a bunch of information. And I actually took the step that we've been talking about, which is we got into the research and reading. [01:18:52] Speaker B: Yeah, man. [01:18:54] Speaker A: And, you know, I think that's the key, unfortunately, people just don't spend enough time to it. So I Read about this one called BPC Body Protective Compound 157. And I remember my buddy talking about that years ago, but I was like. So I read about it and would. You know, there's like, articles of. Are there. There are. There's an article that's very famous for a study that was involving rats, mice, whatever, where they transected the Achilles tendon, okay, in mice, and gave them injections of this compound, this peptide. And wouldn't you know it, that sucker fused and repaired itself. And I was like, whoa, I thought. [01:19:47] Speaker B: They didn't do this. [01:19:49] Speaker A: Started reading about BPC 157, and there's another one, TB 500. And here's the thing. They are peptides. They are peptides that your body naturally produces, but over time, they produce less of them. So we don't have access. Right. And as we get older, we are more prone to injuries like that, but we don't have the mechanisms maybe inherent as much anymore to recover, repair, and move on. Right. And strengthen. So I started using this product, and it's a. It's a subcutaneous injection, very small amount. And it's. It's a protocol that I. I use, and I use it for eight weeks. And guys, I'm. It's weird because people. Well, how did it work? You know? Well, yeah, my arm's not. [01:20:45] Speaker B: It worked. [01:20:46] Speaker A: Well, the thing is, it's not like an overnight. Oh, my gosh, night and day, black, white, you know, I'm all better. It's. It's like, over the course of the time I was using it, I found that, oh, I don't need the sleeve anymore when I play. And, oh, by the way, now it's not hurting. I don't have to use my prednisone anymore, clearly. But Motrin, not as much. And I'm like, it does actually work. And then I started using it and talked about it, and then I started getting testimonials back from clients that used it. I've posted a few of those, but I'm like, really? I've recommended it to a couple of fighter pilot. Fighter guys, you know, that were broke, like, you and I, and. And I'm like, so, how's it working? And the most recent one I got was, well, my shoulder's not hurting as much. And then one guy was like, bones. Five days later, I don't have the same pain. I'm like, are you serious? I mean, I really want to know because. [01:21:50] Speaker B: Yeah, right. Yeah. [01:21:52] Speaker A: You know, don't blow smoke up, you. [01:21:53] Speaker C: Know, so what are the regulations on them? [01:21:58] Speaker A: You know, some of them. It's funny because the fda, if, if you get the prescription, you can get some of these by prescription. And the FDA has. It's funny, I listened to another Huberman podcast. He was talking to a family practice physician that incorporated peptides into their practice. And he gave us very good information, the protocols, everything. And they talked about the FDA's role. And some of them were basically taken off of the market, so to speak, by the FDA for various reasons. And so it's a hit or miss on, on availability. All I can say is that I have found a source that I have asked specifically because the FDA has very stringent guidelines on research. And what am I trying to say? Quality assurance. [01:23:01] Speaker C: Sure. [01:23:03] Speaker A: And I was very specific. I said, okay, so you're not a pharmacy, quote, you're a research lab. What are your protocol? Do you put protocols in place, third party testing? Do you have quality assurance programs? And essentially they said, because we're not a pharmacy regulated by the fda, we can elevate our level of quality assurance. Okay, So I was relieved at that. And, and, and honestly, you don't need a prescription because they're, they are literally formulations of amino acids. [01:23:48] Speaker C: Okay, we'll chat after this because Shelly. [01:23:52] Speaker B: Just recently had her ACL replaced after, after farming. And she was like, I should. Well, you know, this is another one of those things like keto that I mentioned. I, we had. I'd heard of peptides a while ago, and then I saw you post some things on Facebook about peptides. And about the same time I saw your stuff, I listened to a podcast between Joe Rogan and Mark Zuckerberg where Joe, you know, they were talking about their ACL blowing out, and Joe asked Mark, you know, do you use peptides? And Mark was like, no. And Joe's like, what? You don't want to heal? I mean, like, it was, it was something. He was almost berating him because he wasn't using peptides to help heal his knee. And then I'm like, what? And, and so. And then again, you posted another thing. I got to look it into them. And like one of the sites that, that you, the companies that made the peptides that, that you posted about, like, Semaglutide was a prescription free peptide that was offered on their site. And I was like, hang on a minute. You know that there's Ozempic and mount and hymns and hers and whatever else. We're, we're advert days that all require prescriptions. But yet as a peptide it looked like it was a pill format. I don't, I don't know that. But it, it was definitely a no prescription required peptide. And it, and it made me go, I gotta, I gotta talk to Bones about this. How, how are they doing that? [01:25:30] Speaker A: So, yeah, you. That's right. I think the key is you. I really think that you, you should partner with a provider just so that you can discuss, okay, how are we going to reconjugate this peptide? Because it does require reconjugation, meaning you comes to me as a powder. That's. [01:25:51] Speaker B: Oh, I did see that. You have to. You can buy their little water constituted bacteriostatic water. [01:25:58] Speaker A: So we need to have a conversation about that. So the, the point is, I think it's important to get a consultation with a provider so that you can understand, okay, this is how you use this product. And, oh, by the way, how are we going to. What dosage do I need? How often do I use it? What are the side effects? What if I get a side effect? What are my. Here's the kicker. What does my consent look like that's been thrown out the window for the last five years. Right. Informed consent. And that conversation of risk, benefit. And, and I'm, you know, I'm encouraging you and your listeners to bring that back. If it's not part of that discussion, I would very much discourage anyone from just going out and trying to get these type of products without a discussion with a provider. Because, you know, you want to make sure you don't have this in your medical history. You want to make sure you don't on this medicine. You get what I'm saying? [01:27:05] Speaker B: Oh, yeah, I do. And how. We've, we've discussed the difficulty within the medical profession of things that might be not just standard practice and the difficult. Like what, what, what do we ask for? How do we find this unicorn doctor that's going to work with us and allow us to inject ourselves with peptides that we bought over the counter? [01:27:31] Speaker A: That's a funny question, but it's true. I think there's some buzzwords out there will gravitate towards, like, functional medicine. That's what I've seen. I've also seen these products advertising anti aging. I don't actually like to use those buzzwords as much as I like to use humor, performance, kind of centric. Okay, but, but more importantly, the relationship that you have with your doctor should be a partnership. It's, it's not a superior, inferior. It's just a partnership. So that if you ask A question to your doctor about peptides, and they're not willing to have that discussion or at least be open to research as well. Then you might shop around. [01:28:23] Speaker B: Got it. [01:28:24] Speaker C: Yeah, that makes, it makes sense. [01:28:27] Speaker B: Who was the lady that. The podcast you were listening to about peptides, Dr. Tina Moore. [01:28:33] Speaker C: Have you heard of her? [01:28:35] Speaker B: She was talking about microdosing, some of them. [01:28:38] Speaker C: Yeah, she was talking to. I, I heard her on Mark Hyman's podcast, one of his more recent ones, maybe a day or two ago. And she was talking about like the difference between your Ozempic because it's just a macro dose, one for, you know, one, one size fits all kind of deal. And then her, she's talking about micro dosing these things like droplets and talking about human performance that especially. She really focuses on a lot of menopause perimenopause as we go through these changes in life and our bodies aren't making the peptides like they used to. They're not as supple as they used to be and able to heal themselves. And that she does a lot with bioidentical hormone therapy. And listening to her, I was fascinating to hear that there may be uses for some of these peptides in ways like if you're already working out and you're healthy and you're eating clean, you could take these types of doses of these things and really elevate your performance. [01:29:56] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think micro dosing is also important for people that use those products that may have side effects from them. Because that, that, that mega dose once a week, man, some people have some pretty good nausea that just lasts for days. And no wonder they're losing weight. They're not hungry, they throw up and they feel terrible. But right, if you micro dose, you might be able to get the benefit of the metabolic, metabolic changes instead of, you know, kind of a once a week, boom. It works the same way with. And here's, here's something I see in like that men's health clinic I told you about. It's really crazy. You've heard of low T and testosterone, but what I've found is that over time you would, you would be surprised at how young the, that the men are that are low T. And unfortunately, you know, sometimes giving those kids injections just kind of gets their T up. But then it just. So I, I've run into, you know, people that get one shot every two weeks. I'm like, man, that's really not the way that hormone functions in the body. You might consider a more cyclical Dosing schedule that more approximates kind of what you said, you know, your biorhythms and micro dosing smaller volumes more frequently. It might be a little more painful if you do the injections, but it's going to simulate that identical biorhythm a little bit. [01:31:31] Speaker B: So is there, is there like, do you, do you do these, do you sell these? Is there a site that you would recommend? [01:31:39] Speaker A: Oh yeah. [01:31:40] Speaker B: So should we just hit Google Peptides? Like how would you, how if, if we really are interested this, what would you, where would you send us? [01:31:49] Speaker A: I can be found at my website, which is Complete care and care is spelled with A K. Complete care.com I. [01:31:57] Speaker B: I if that's it, I can show it real quick on the, on the screen. [01:32:02] Speaker A: Complete care.com and you can use the drop downs and you'll find peptides on there. So that's it. Yeah. [01:32:11] Speaker B: Is it? [01:32:12] Speaker A: There you go. That's it. So that, that is the kind of the intro to talking about them. And you can see some drop downs on the right over there. Yeah, but if you see the last thing bolded my peptide catalog, you just click on that picture and that takes you to kind of the site that you guys were talking about where you can explore different functions. It should, when you actually go to this site, link you to another there you go site that has the catalog of peptides and you can explore that. And you know, this is where I really encourage people to find. If they're having an issue, you know, see if some of those broad categories address that issue. But more importantly, connect with whoever shared that with you so that you can, if you, I really encourage you to get some kind of medical person to consult because that way, you know, and if you want to use me, I'm happy. But if you don't, then I do encourage you to find somebody that's familiar with them so that you can discuss what's next. [01:33:28] Speaker B: Okay, that makes sense because that company. [01:33:31] Speaker A: Has a consultation service. But you know, a lot of doctors are familiar with this stuff now maybe not. I think it's growing. [01:33:42] Speaker C: Good. [01:33:43] Speaker A: But for those that are interested. [01:33:45] Speaker B: Cool. That's really cool. [01:33:48] Speaker C: So do you see the medical establishment or at large beginning to wake up and make some changes as far as nutrition is concerned? [01:33:59] Speaker A: Oh, well, no, no, I don't, I don't know. Let me. The pandemic really, I mean, you guys know this, that's maybe that influenced a lot of what you do, but it really opened up a lot of people's eyes. And unfortunately, unfortunately me included, it Closed a lot of people's eyes to traditional medicine. I mean, the, the majority of my clients, some patients, now some of the conversations that we have, it's almost, almost universal theme. I lost trust in my doctor. I lost trust in public health. I lost trust in nih. I lost trust in cdc. Dude, that's me too. I. So I share that same confusion and distrust with them a lot. And, and so I think those people, maybe they're the ones that could be the majority of your audience. You know, I think we all deserve a chance at dialogue. Right. They're, they're, you know, you can't say the science is settled. [01:35:23] Speaker C: Right. [01:35:24] Speaker A: Oh, my God. The most abused term I heard was trust the science. I'm like, come on. [01:35:31] Speaker C: Right, right. [01:35:34] Speaker A: That really, that really caused a lot of problems with me as far as, you know, psycho. You and I gave a lot of years to the defense of the country, to the Constitution and what it stands for and those agencies that are represented therein. And to have that just kind of trampled on. Boy, that really gave me a bad taste in my mouth about a lot of things. And some people don't see it like that, which is really eye opening to me. Yeah. You know, and so I, I think that that kind of led me into doing a lot of the same thing you guys are doing, which is reading, talking, having conversations like this where we talk about possibilities, you know. Yeah. The big one for me a lot is, you know, people that were injured by the COVID vaccine. And, you know, I still have colleagues today that just like, what do you mean? And I'm like, man, yeah. [01:36:41] Speaker C: Well, I can tell you that the medical community is very good at acute things. [01:36:46] Speaker A: Yeah. United. [01:36:47] Speaker C: The, the physicians and surgeons in the United States can fix somebody like it's nobody's business. [01:36:53] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:36:53] Speaker C: You know, I tore my knee up hard, hard, hard, hard. And they can put Humpty Dumpty back together again. Really, really. Well, you know, we just like to focus on, and I know you do too, the situation with the metabolic dysfunction and the chronic disease going on and that, that is the majority of our budget. That's where all of the money is going. And, and that's what, and that's what's actually killing people, is those things. And that's why if, if the medical community writ large is not really changing their minds about how to, how to treat and mitigate or they're under, or maybe they're just under a set of pressures that we're not given by whomever they work for and such the system yeah. We're independent, so we can do and say what we want for the most part. But it, that's where I, we keep preaching and pounding is you have, you're going to have to. While the medical community is good at a lot of things, they're not good at everything. And we're just gonna have to take this into our own hands. [01:38:07] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:38:08] Speaker C: I can't, can't preach it enough. [01:38:10] Speaker A: I'm anxious to see what happens with rfk. I mean it's really crazy. If you took, if you ask. The medical community hasn't changed, man. The dichotomy and impressions of his nomination, it's on both sides of the fence. He's the worst thing to ever happen to medicine. He's the best thing to ever happen to medicine. And, and it's very, you know, kind of varied and I'm anxious to see because maybe he aligns with what I'm trying to say. What you guys are trying to say as far as get our food right, get us moving and you know, get rid of the corruption from the pharmaceutical. [01:38:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [01:38:56] Speaker C: Medical industry. [01:38:58] Speaker B: Yeah. The thing that gave me hope I think was that like we were following Casey and Kelly Means pretty closely before he, you know, the Maha movement and the, oh yeah. Joining the, the, the campaign trail for Trump and like, like we, and so to, to listen to them and he, as they talk about a lot of these issues and if you boil it down to like fast forward to the end of the thing where they typically get asked, okay, well what is the solution? It is typically very encouraging to us. Local food, good food, go back to nutrition, go back, stop eating the ultra processed foods, get the seed oils out of your life. Like it's, it's all of, all of these types of things. But they, it's, it typically in that conversation is find a local farmer, eat grass fed beef, you know, like these types of things. And we're like, oh my gosh, you know, I think we're, we're here like we're doing this already. And it was just, it was pretty neat to hear. Like we were very encouraged to hear some people talking about it on very popular different shows like the, the, the things that we are doing as being potentially or the only even solution to like the opposite of make America healthy is make America sick. So like if the, the make keep America sick is all of the things that we've been doing right. Like it, it, if, if we're wanting everyone to stay sick, then keep doing this and if we're trying to make health come Back then we have to change. There has to be a something else. Right? And like for me, even from the, the medical establishment, that would be the man there. You, there's got to be a root cause here, right? Like go to a fighter pilot debrief and what's your, what is your actual root cause analysis? Let's get to some debrief focus points. Like something is wrong, right? Like we can't just, we can't just go like, you know, it's typically back to the, the planning or the brief, right? It's, it's not normally execution, right? It's not normally. I gave you too low of a dose of some medicine, right? It's normally back here somewhere and right. Like, man, I, I would, I, I'm hoping that the discussion at least of, of nutrition and tied to health will cause some type of introspection that would cause that. You know, let's, let's focus on, on what's actually going wrong here and not just keep whacking a mole, right? You know, boy, you make good points. [01:41:47] Speaker A: I'll tell you what, if you did another podcast on that, you know, to put your. And you may have already, so forgive me if you've already done that, but if you have just described a fighter pilot's mission, right? We have an objective. We brief it up, we debrief to the objectives and then we talk about the nuances that led us to either meeting that objective or not and putting that in the perspective of health, food, man and medicine. Wow. What's our objective? Right? Yeah, you kind of nailed it. And man, we need to get you out there to bring that together. Right? And bring that. Are we meeting our objective? Why not? And let's talk about it. Because, man, that is so true. And here's. That's the hard part about my conversations with maybe medical colleagues is they're not seeing the same mission failures. Maybe. You know what I mean? [01:42:56] Speaker B: That's interesting. [01:42:56] Speaker C: That's interesting. [01:42:57] Speaker B: Well, how can somebody that's typically like a young, young B course level fighter pilot when they can't even see the mistake? [01:43:06] Speaker A: Well, they don't know they've made one because they don't see the outcome as detrimental. Like, you just nailed it, man. Are we getting healthier? [01:43:15] Speaker B: Right? [01:43:16] Speaker A: No, but. So if you're in the medical industrial complex and you don't support somebody who's out there talking about making the country healthy, then what are we doing? Yeah. Yes. [01:43:34] Speaker B: Yes, that, that's exactly the question. [01:43:38] Speaker A: What are we doing as doctors? You know, first do no harm Man. Yeah. [01:43:43] Speaker B: Wow. Yeah. [01:43:44] Speaker C: So if you could give someone that's listening one piece of advice to change their life today, what would that be? [01:43:56] Speaker A: I would say first shop at Air to Ground meets. [01:44:01] Speaker C: That is fantastic advice, you know. Yeah. [01:44:05] Speaker A: Checks in the mail. You guys are the perimeter of the store. That's where you find your food. [01:44:10] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure. [01:44:13] Speaker A: So that's what I would say. Get out of the aisles. [01:44:17] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:44:18] Speaker A: Stick to the perimeter. [01:44:19] Speaker C: Yeah. [01:44:20] Speaker A: I always tell clients, buy things that have a mom and a dad or that grow above the ground and avoid the white foods. That's it. [01:44:29] Speaker B: That's great. [01:44:29] Speaker C: That's great. Yeah, that's beautiful. [01:44:32] Speaker A: Yep. [01:44:33] Speaker B: Shelly normally says if it is what it always was, you know. [01:44:36] Speaker A: Oh, yeah, that's great. [01:44:38] Speaker B: Like. [01:44:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:44:39] Speaker B: If it hasn't been chemically. [01:44:41] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:44:42] Speaker B: Destroyed and put back together as something. [01:44:44] Speaker C: Else, it's probably okay. [01:44:46] Speaker A: It's probably okay. [01:44:47] Speaker C: It's probably okay. Yeah. [01:44:48] Speaker A: That would be the one thing I think to start the fork is probably the biggest culprit in most everything that I've talked to clients about. And yeah, people struggle. People struggle with it, man. [01:45:00] Speaker C: Well, we do. We. It's just it, it's a very toxic. Lots of drugs out there for us to pick from when we go in the grocery store, you know, and it's, it is, it's a tough, tough environment. But I do believe that the more that people begin to. If they can begin to see what it's really doing to them, that it's really, really toxic and it's really actually poisoning what their bodies. And we can convince them. See, that's another thing when we're wrapping this up, but when we get offered sugar laden sweet things donuts. Eat the donut. Eat the donut. Aren't you going to have a donut? Do you ever not have a donut? And what he'll. No, no, no, thank you. No, thank you. Well, why not? Well, because somewhere along the way, somewhere in about 2019, I decided and came to understand that it's really, really bad for me. And once you come to that point and you realize it's really, really bad for me, I'm not going to put it down in my mouth anymore. And if you can, if we can get people to come to that point to understand it isn't about. It's about don't do that. Don't eat the ultra processed foods. It's toxic to your system. Are there alternatives that we could replace that with? Let's try that first. [01:46:35] Speaker A: Sure. [01:46:36] Speaker C: And what's on your fork or what's on in the wrapper. You know, if we can put those things down and if you can understand how bad it really is for you, then you probably just won't do it anymore. [01:46:51] Speaker A: Well, yeah, but remember, heroin's the same. [01:46:55] Speaker B: Thing, except not quite as addictive. [01:47:00] Speaker C: Yeah. And we've come full circle, Right? [01:47:04] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:47:06] Speaker C: Okay. So you mentioned your website, Jay. Where can. Where else can somebody find you? [01:47:10] Speaker A: Oh, gosh, I hate to say this, but if you just Google my name, all kinds of stuff will pop up. [01:47:16] Speaker C: Okay. Are you. Are you doing any public speaking right now? [01:47:22] Speaker A: No, I. It's really weird. I have. I have done some of that with some organizations that I'm kind of affiliated with, but I think some of the beauty of what I've been able to do is. I don't want to say hide, but I've kind of. I've kept under the radar in a lot of ways. [01:47:45] Speaker C: Okay. [01:47:45] Speaker A: And I'm not affiliated with corporate medicine from a. I don't have a clinic that I go to to practice. You know, I'm a director or supervisor at different places. But I've been able to shield myself from a lot of corporate medicine, and I think that's. That's on purpose. So I. I keep my clientele close to me, and that's really cool. Yeah, I keep them. [01:48:16] Speaker B: I really like that. [01:48:18] Speaker A: Yeah. I keep those relationships because I don't. I don't want to be. Not forced, but I don't want to, you know, have that conversation sometimes where, oh, yeah, you can't do that. Or that's going against the board of umpty frats. Because, you know, I'm like, man. I like to do it that way because it's very personal with my kids. [01:48:45] Speaker C: That's really cool. [01:48:46] Speaker B: That is cool. Do you have anything that's really neat? No. Is there something that we should have talked about, Bones, that. That we. That we missed? Like, is there. [01:48:54] Speaker A: We. Yeah. Hit a lot, dude. I. I have. I really enjoyed that. I don't have a whole lot of things that I. I think we missed. [01:49:05] Speaker B: Okay. [01:49:06] Speaker C: Okay. [01:49:06] Speaker B: Cool. [01:49:06] Speaker A: Good. [01:49:08] Speaker B: Awesome. [01:49:08] Speaker C: Well, thank you so much for your time and, you know, your friendship. And if I could add. I'm going to add a little story just right here at the end. [01:49:18] Speaker B: Okay. [01:49:21] Speaker C: As it turns out, you guys were both in the same IFF course. [01:49:24] Speaker A: I believe that's right. [01:49:26] Speaker C: And you might not know this, but you are the only aviator to have gotten a dg. And he didn't. Out of. He went through nav training, all kinds of courses, because he was in the back seat first went back to pilot training. He was the D. He's the DG of his life. And except for that one little stint in IFF when Bones. [01:49:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [01:49:52] Speaker C: Was in there too. [01:49:53] Speaker A: And yeah, that is absolutely true. I can't, because that is so funny because believe it or not, I remember that because I'm like, who's this Rich McLamry guy? And. And you got Air to Ground Top Gun. Yeah, I did and I remember that. And I got Air to Air Top Gun. And I remember talking with one of the IPS years later because I went back to be an IFF instructor. He's like, man, that was a close race. [01:50:27] Speaker B: That's awesome. [01:50:29] Speaker C: Well, thank you so much for your time and I really will be hooking, getting with you about getting some peptides and figuring out how to get my knee better faster. [01:50:38] Speaker A: I like it. [01:50:40] Speaker C: All right, take care. [01:50:42] Speaker A: See ya. Bye.