The Hidden Truth About Modern Farming in 2025!

[00:00:00] Speaker A: When you think of a farmer, you probably think of someone driving a tractor or checking their livestock as the sun rises at dawn. But for 96% of farmers, that is not the only story. [00:00:14] Speaker B: Welcome to the Duster Mud podcast. I'm Shelley and I'm rich. After 25 years of being in the Air Force, Rich retired about four years ago and we started a regenerative farm and this podcast and we like to talk about food freedom and farming. And today we're going to talk about farm mers. [00:00:32] Speaker A: Yeah, definitely in the squarely, in the realm of farming. [00:00:36] Speaker B: Yeah. And some of the things that we've learned and talk about a couple of articles that you kind of ran across the other day. [00:00:43] Speaker A: Yeah. So 96% to include us of farmers have something in common. [00:00:53] Speaker B: And what is that? [00:00:55] Speaker A: Well, this spans all farmers. [00:00:57] Speaker B: All of them. So you are a crop. [00:00:59] Speaker A: We're a multi species regenerative farm. [00:01:02] Speaker B: We're very niche. [00:01:03] Speaker A: Yeah, very niche. Just ask the usda. [00:01:05] Speaker B: Right. [00:01:06] Speaker A: There are row crop farmers, there are dairy farmers, cattle farmers, strawberry farmers even. [00:01:14] Speaker B: Right. [00:01:15] Speaker A: And 96% of us all share of something. [00:01:19] Speaker B: Y'all know what that is? Off farm income. Yep, 96%. Almost 100% of farmers in the United States have off farm income coming into their farm to help sustain the thing, sustain the family. [00:01:43] Speaker A: Yeah. So what that means is for 96% of us, the farm is not and cannot be the sole source of income. And it, it varies based on age groups and type of farming and, and this type of thing. [00:02:00] Speaker B: But like, and the size of the farm. We'll get into that. [00:02:03] Speaker A: Oh yeah, that's, that's very important. [00:02:05] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:02:05] Speaker A: The size of the farm. [00:02:07] Speaker B: Yeah. Because. Well, those demographics really matter. Speaking of like the size of the farm, our farm is about 160 acres. [00:02:19] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:02:20] Speaker B: We have 30 something cows. We've got about 30 something pigs out there. We have 200 and something meat chickens growing right now, 180 layer hens laying eggs, three dairy cows, 50 sheep, another 50 lambs on the ground and some before the piglets. So to give you an ide of that's we're small and we're like we just said, we're niche. So. And the USDA defines a farm as any land or family business, whatever, that brings in $1,000 or more of revenue per year. So if you sell a bunch of eggs, but you get $1,000 maybe at the farmer's market selling your eggs, your farm. [00:03:11] Speaker A: Yep. [00:03:11] Speaker B: If you sell one hog or two hogs and in $1,000 from your even your homestead, call It a farmstead, you're a farm. So there are there. So it's very broad from multi billion dollar industry row crop type people to a homestead who sells their things at the farmer's market. Creating some, a little bit of cash on the side. So but that being said, 96% is a lot whenever you're talking about a very broad amount of people who grow food. [00:03:51] Speaker A: Yeah. And for us, I retired, I was 48, shell had just turned 49 and I was about to be 49. And the, our military retirement check is really the only thing that has allowed us to do what we're doing. Without it there's we would definitely have to go to work. Right. Like that pension or retirement income or whatever you want to call it has allowed us to stay here and build what we've built, build this farm. And the capital required for us as a first generation starting from scratch. We had no equipment, we had no land. I mean like we had nothing. And starting, starting from scratch to build even a niche regenerative farm, the capital required is crazy. [00:04:48] Speaker B: Right. And if, and we had some things because we were older, we had some monies and whatnot that we were able to cobble together to get this thing purchased and off of the ground because we're older in, in years we were and had other experience in life. But it's a little bit of a different story when you're talking about the younger crow because the 30 somethings and 35 and younger, they don't have those years of saving or investments or other income that from a 25 year career that to, to supplement. So those guys are in a wholly different predicament I guess. You know, trying to get their farms off the ground. [00:05:34] Speaker A: That's right. So that's the reality of modern farming in the United States today is you probably have an off farm job. And what we want to talk about is that's not failure. [00:05:48] Speaker B: No. [00:05:49] Speaker A: That's just survival. [00:05:50] Speaker B: Right. [00:05:51] Speaker A: Like we're all growing food, we're all contributing to the network of food in this nation. And the fact that off farm income is required does not mean we're failing as farmers. It means we're farmers. [00:06:09] Speaker B: Yeah. Now it doesn't mean that. It doesn't kind of make me a little bit grumpy. I'm gonna be real. I wish that the, the farming career, the farming vocation, the, the act of growing food was more profitable and I wish that it was more, less volatile for everyone. I do wish that, I wish that you could make all kinds of money being a farmer. But that's not always the case, you know. And so we just have to look at the positive side of putting that good food back into our communities, you know, and having income to do it. Right. [00:07:01] Speaker A: So some of the numbers, 96% of farm households have, have some form of off farm income, which we basically just talked about. Only 23% of household income comes from farming activities. So the other. [00:07:20] Speaker B: Right. Wow. [00:07:23] Speaker A: 77% comes from off farm. And they include in that off farm, you know, jobs, punching a punch card, time card. They include other businesses, they include retirement checks such as ours. [00:07:40] Speaker B: Well, yeah, they call it like non activity Social Security. Those types of income checks coming in here. This one was a little disturbing. This statistic. Median farm income in 2023 was a $900 loss, while median off farm income was $79,900. So the farms were losing $900. While your off farm income is stable, you know that you're going to get that 80,000 almost dollars by going to work, showing up and getting not only the income, but the benefits that go with it. That is very important also. [00:08:24] Speaker A: That's right, yeah, yeah. $900 loss and that's median. [00:08:29] Speaker B: Yeah. I mean, you know that whenever you're entering the farm lifestyle that probably you're going to start pinching your pennies, things are going to get tight, you're going to have, you're growing a business, you're getting something off of the ground. Rice and beans, beans and rice, all of that. But you don't think I'm going to work my tail off sweating, growing something to lose $900 annual? [00:08:57] Speaker A: That's reality. [00:08:58] Speaker B: I know, I know. Yeah. [00:09:01] Speaker A: And that reality was a bit shocking to us, I would say, just from a personal story perspective. We went into this saying we would like the farm to pay for itself and we would like to live off of our retirement income and we will do all of the work for the farm and put it back into the farm. And you know, we'll consider that not being bored in retirement. I mean, that was sort of our mentality as we went into this and started the whole thing. And what we've found is our retirement income has consistently over the past four years paid for into the farm. [00:09:39] Speaker B: Right? It has, but I also add the really cool part of it has consistently allowed us to grow the farm. Truth, where we started out with some ducks and guineas, not my recommended way to start anymore, but we started out with some, some birds and some livestock, dogs. And we literally grew this thing from no animals to all of the things that I mentioned earlier and what we started by selling a whole pig and now we sell pork chops and sausage. And we, that income has allowed us to build a direct to consumer business that is working and it's growing and we have grown it every single year. And more and more revenue continues to come in. But the reality is we're still writing checks, growing it. They say three to five years for a business but I think for a farm, for a farm to, to be able to live off of the type of farming that we're doing, we're looking at probably another maybe three years. [00:10:52] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:10:53] Speaker B: @ least I think you're looking at closer to 10. [00:10:55] Speaker A: It was interesting we mentioned something like that to our accountant the first time we, first time we met her that you know, yes, it shows a loss but businesses are supposed to show a loss for three to five. You know we gave her the standard talking points and her comment back to us was not on a farm. Farms don't make money. [00:11:14] Speaker B: Right. [00:11:15] Speaker A: And if you look at the numbers, a 900 loss. She's right. [00:11:20] Speaker B: And that may all be very much by design. You might have a really, really nice farm that is worth a couple million dollars who doesn't really show profit. [00:11:34] Speaker A: Right. [00:11:35] Speaker B: But they got new gates. [00:11:36] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:11:37] Speaker B: And they've got a nice truck. [00:11:38] Speaker A: And I would, I would go along with you on that if it weren't for 96% of the farmers having off farming jobs. Right. Like so it's not like the farm is making so much money that we have to dump money somewhere to show a loss. Like everybody's working off farm. [00:11:59] Speaker B: True. [00:12:00] Speaker A: You know, just to make ends meet. [00:12:02] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:03] Speaker A: And so like maybe there's some write offs and, and such, you know, agriculture and schedule f and those types of things. But like the reality is only 4%. [00:12:18] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:12:19] Speaker A: Of farmers are living off of farm income only. [00:12:22] Speaker B: Well some of the reasons when we touched on it a second ago, having an off farm job, it's better, it's more reliable pay. You know, you're, the paycheck is going to come in at the beginning of the month. Yay, we got paid again. Sweet. You know, we do, we do this. You know, thank goodness. You know, health care people, you get health insurance, you know, they'll go if you're, if you're a teacher or you're a banker or you're working in a hospital or whatever. Maybe it's the health care health insurance for your family because otherwise you're trying to get health care through the healthcare market or whatever the like. [00:13:04] Speaker A: Our very good friends Obamacare type stuff or homesteaders. [00:13:07] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:13:08] Speaker A: Self employed, not working outside for any business. [00:13:12] Speaker B: Right. [00:13:13] Speaker A: And their health care through the marketplace. Through the marketplace. Their health care is terrible. And it's really expensive. [00:13:20] Speaker B: Right. And it's income based. So if you make a very good income, you're going to pay a lot more for what you're getting. And your policies are just really not good at all. They're almost catastrophic policies. They really don't. The. It's terrible. So a lot of times people will go get. At least one person in the family will go get an off farm job to bring the health care insurance into the picture. [00:13:47] Speaker A: Yeah. And retirement, we mentioned our retirement. Well, that's 25 years of service got us that retirement. And if you're in the prime of your life in those working years, you, a lot of folks want a job that has some type of retirement plan with it so that when they get to be, you know, ready for retirement. Yeah, there's, there's something there. [00:14:13] Speaker B: Sure. [00:14:13] Speaker A: And if you're, you know, net farm income or you know, median farm income is negative 900 a year, that isn't providing you your retirement, you know. [00:14:28] Speaker B: No. 40% of farmers or spouses said that farm related financial stress pushed them to find other work. Like just the stress alone of the finances. Because feed costs, oh my, you know, especially if you're feeding pigs, I'm gonna tell you right now, that's expensive. Feed costs, seed, diesel, equipment maintenance and management. Something breaks and you need to buy a whole new one, you know, a new side by side that are so, you know, important to have on farms. Getting around a new side by side alone. I mean it is going to run you $25,000 now. [00:15:10] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:15:11] Speaker B: You know, just costs that are associated with farming and that's a lot of what the, when we say putting into the farm, those are the types of costs that we're talking about. The capital that is required, you just kind of keep putting into it the capital. It comes back, but it's required as those animals keep eating. [00:15:34] Speaker A: Yeah. It's interesting the amount of debt that's accruing right now in the farm sector across the nation. Farm credit services. I had, I didn't even know what it was. I looked it up, man. They hold a lot like over $150 billion right now of farm debt through, I believe through just them. I'll throw the, the charts up as I edit this. But like there's, there's a lot of debt right now. [00:16:03] Speaker B: We're talking about the size of the farms and the dependence on the off farm income, if you're, if the farm is about $100,000 or less revenue annually. Highly dependent. I mean that's not enough to live on. [00:16:21] Speaker A: Highly dependent. [00:16:22] Speaker B: Highly dependent on the off farm income. Whereas half a million dollars and above are less dependent and probably are able to, you know, those, those guys are hiring some operational, you know, workers and things like that. You get up into that. If you're getting that kind of revenue, you need help. Yeah, I can assure you of that. [00:16:43] Speaker A: They consider small farm to be less than 100,000 and a large farm to be greater than a million. [00:16:48] Speaker B: So what's that in between thing? I guess you got a medium. [00:16:51] Speaker A: Yeah, I think it's a medium. [00:16:52] Speaker B: I guess, I guess it's a medium, yeah. Wow. [00:16:56] Speaker A: The majority of the farms though, like from a numbers perspective are, are small farms. So like the. [00:17:03] Speaker B: Oh yeah. [00:17:04] Speaker A: Way higher number of small farms. Way lower number of large farms. The large farms are making the majority of the money though. [00:17:10] Speaker B: Right. And another interesting thing, well, it's not really, y'all probably won't be surprised by this, but the. Who is working, which industry. Farming industry is working off farm and which are not like cattle men. [00:17:26] Speaker A: Yeah. So let, let's guess who's. Who's the most on farm. Who spends the most time on farm from an industry perspective. [00:17:37] Speaker B: You probably guessed it right. Dairy. Dairy. Those cows have to be milked multiple times a day. High, high operational, hands on maintenance management, you know, a lot of management intensive going on in dairies. [00:17:52] Speaker A: Yeah. 81% of the dairy industry, 81% of their income comes from the farm oftentimes. [00:18:01] Speaker B: And if you're a homesteader, you know this. Do we get a milk cow or do we not get a milk cow? [00:18:06] Speaker A: Oh man, when, when we started this whole thing, I was dead set. I was there, there was one thing that I was a hard no on and that was a dairy cow. I was like, absolutely not. A dairy cow is an anchor. You can't ever shake it. It's change to you. Like you can't leave, you can't do anything. [00:18:25] Speaker B: That cow has to be milked. So even on homesteads, those that have dairy cows are going to be on that homestead or, or the small farm way more than somebody who does not have a dairy cow. Because you know, I mean if some things you can leave enough feed out there and make sure they've got water and you're good to go for a. [00:18:47] Speaker A: Little while or you know, you have somebody come and throw scratch out to your chickens and gather the eggs, sure, that's not a big deal. But to ask somebody to saddle up to that thousand pound beast and start, you know, milking. Milking, yeah. That's a, that's a hard ask. Harder ask than right. Will you please gather the eggs? [00:19:07] Speaker B: Now back to the industries. As we talk about those animals, you can imagine that the one that works off farm most is cattlemen. [00:19:21] Speaker A: Yeah, I believe Cattlemen and crop farms. [00:19:25] Speaker B: Okay. Crop farms, they were about the same though, right. [00:19:28] Speaker A: Cattle's 10% are on farm income and crop farmers are 9. [00:19:33] Speaker B: Okay, 9%. So that because you know, it just doesn't take as much intensive management to do. Cow calf pair, you can go, you can have cows out in the field and check on them. [00:19:46] Speaker A: Yep. [00:19:46] Speaker B: Rotate them. [00:19:47] Speaker A: Right. [00:19:48] Speaker B: Automatic waters and grass and hay. You know that you just don't have to be there all the time. You really, you've got time on your hands and crops kind of the same. It's you know, planting season and harvest season windows intensive. But there are times when there's nothing in the field growing or there are times when you're just kind of waiting for it to grow, doing the thing. So they have time also on their hands that they can go supplement their life through doing something else. [00:20:20] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:20:20] Speaker B: You know, teaching math or not that. Why did I even say that? [00:20:26] Speaker A: Cuz ew, it's good stuff. [00:20:28] Speaker B: Like ew. Teach social studies or something. [00:20:34] Speaker A: No way. [00:20:35] Speaker B: I can tell you one thing, you're never going to catch me teaching. Well that's not always true because I have a homeschooler. [00:20:40] Speaker A: But like what are you talking. [00:20:43] Speaker B: I think we were just doing I don't know percents the other day, but I wouldn't want to be going to teach math every day, all day. [00:20:52] Speaker A: Age matters as well for who's on and off farm. So you, you mentioned it already. But the, the young beginning farmers because a lot of times like if you don't inherit it, you're not independently wealthy and you haven't built up some cash cow or retirement like it's tough. [00:21:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:21:15] Speaker A: And so for the, the younger farmers only 20% work on farm only. So 80% of younger farmers have an off farm job. [00:21:26] Speaker B: Yeah. And that, if you think about it, that really does make sense. Yeah. [00:21:31] Speaker A: And they're trying to cover all of the, the costs. [00:21:35] Speaker B: You know, I, I think there are some programs out there for your, your startup kids, but it's no, it's just a hard thing to get into. [00:21:46] Speaker A: And we stopped by the USDA office the other day to see if there wasn't some USDA program that could help, you know, struggling farmers like us and really struggling. No, they, they told us that we were too niche really for any, any USDA program. But he said, he did say that he was able to help a 19 year old get a quarter of a million dollar loan to buy cows. And I'm like, whoa, man. [00:22:17] Speaker B: To take out a quarter million dollars at 19 years old for cows, man, especially in this market right now. Because they're pricey. [00:22:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:26] Speaker B: And the bottom could drop out of. [00:22:28] Speaker A: It or it could continue to go up. [00:22:31] Speaker B: It could, it could. [00:22:32] Speaker A: But that was that one I left sort of shaking my nugget going, man. [00:22:38] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:39] Speaker A: I can't imagine being 19 and. Oh, and the, the government. A quarter of a million dollars. [00:22:43] Speaker B: Yeah. Yeah. But good on him. He must, you know, he must, he must. Maybe he knows what he's doing. [00:22:49] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:22:50] Speaker B: You know, he comes from cows and getting in cows. [00:22:53] Speaker A: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. [00:22:55] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:22:56] Speaker A: So the, the reality of the costs in farming are like, that is something that is, we now feel. Yeah, it's, it was a, an ethereal thing. Yeah. It's gonna, there's gonna be startup costs and stuff like that. But now. [00:23:12] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:12] Speaker A: Like I can, I can definitely feel it. [00:23:15] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:23:16] Speaker A: You know, the reality of it's expensive. [00:23:19] Speaker B: It is expensive, but it is like so worth it. And just one piece of advice. If you, if you want to farm, you can farm. And if you put something in the ground or if you have a desire to do chickens or whatever, you farm anything, you're farming, growing something. [00:23:38] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:39] Speaker B: But I would. One thing we did do and I would highly recommend to start, start small and grow into it. [00:23:45] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:23:46] Speaker B: You know, don't, don't buy 30 feeder pigs and think I'm gonna feed these things out because it's probably going to cost you. You know, if you're using conventional feed, it may cost you upwards of $10,000 to feed those things out. [00:23:59] Speaker A: Right. [00:24:00] Speaker B: And so you have to know how much it's gonna, it's gonna take before you can even get to the finish line. And that doesn't even put any money back in your, in your account. So start small, small. Start with 1 or 2 or 10 and start with a few birds. Like just, just don't overdo it. And then allow yourself your knowledge base and your income and your marketing and your farmers market relationships. The whole thing can grow organically if you just, if you just don't go out, don't get your, don't get out in front of your, over your skis, you know, or your cart before the horse thing. [00:24:39] Speaker A: So for some though, like, for what we've done. Absolutely, like, because you don't have a market. [00:24:46] Speaker B: Right. [00:24:46] Speaker A: You didn't exist and now you do exist. You weren't producing meat and now you are like, nobody knows you're here. Nobody knows what your product is. Nobody knows who you are. You know, the idea, you just go buy 30 feeder pigs. Like, who are you selling those to and for what price and how much does it cost you to raise them? And you know, like all of that, the business side, the marketing, the sales side is really important and a place to spend a lot of time on when you're, when you're starting, like a niche type, direct to consumer especially. But you know, for some, like your cow calf pairs, I'm just taking them to the market, you know, like, they don't really have to. They're not building a customer base or. [00:25:33] Speaker B: Right, that's true. [00:25:34] Speaker A: You know, that type of thing. So you could, you are at the whim of the market, you know, so like not saying that it's easy, but they, there's not that same marketing and sales perspective of it. And a lot of farmers don't want that. They don't like it. I don't want to talk to people. I don't. You know, I'll go get to know the guys at the livestock market and that's it. Like, I'm not standing at a market or a farmer's market. I'm not shaking hands, gripping and grinning and trying to sell stuff like, you know, there are a lot of farmers. [00:26:05] Speaker B: I'm gonna grow soybeans and corn and that's what I'm gonna do. [00:26:08] Speaker A: And I'll talk to the guy that comes and we will talk about the prices. [00:26:12] Speaker B: Right. [00:26:12] Speaker A: Like, Right. So there's definitely different types of farming and, and with each one, you really just gotta think through all the way to that negative $900 a year. [00:26:27] Speaker B: Wow. Well, the negative 900 a year. There's a lot of negatives going on right now, especially in 2025. And that being said, the current environment is that the, their, their incomes are being propped up. They're being propped up by the government. [00:26:47] Speaker A: Well, it's looking like, if you look at the, the chart, at the graphs, it's like, oh man, the, you know, farm income is recovering. 2025 is going to be a good year. [00:26:54] Speaker B: Right. [00:26:55] Speaker A: You know, so. But where is it coming from? [00:26:58] Speaker B: $31 billion in emergency disaster aid. Yeah, it's coming from places like that. [00:27:03] Speaker A: Right. It's being Artificially propped by the government. So input costs are high, the, you know, yields are low and it's being propped up by these one time payments from the government. So it looks good. [00:27:17] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:27:18] Speaker A: But the reality is it is not showing you a healthy. [00:27:24] Speaker B: Well, it's not showing you reality. An actual. What's really going on. [00:27:28] Speaker A: Yeah, it's, you know, the, the farming industry, it looks like, oh, it's recovered from the drops the past couple of years when in reality it hasn't. It's just there's some one time government payments. [00:27:43] Speaker B: The. We did a podcast some months or weeks ago about the farming crisis kind of looming this year and the numbers might look like there's not really one. But the fact remains that the farm economy is really fragile. Really, really fragile. And especially right now with uncertainties going on with the tariffs. Farmers don't know where their crops are going to go, what they're going to be sold for, how much they should grow. They haven't paid off the debt from last year that they borrowed so that they could grow. I mean it's just, it's a, it's a real, it's just really fragile right this second. I was going to say it was real something else but I decided not to. It's concerning to say the least, I think. [00:28:33] Speaker A: And that goes back to the, the steady known income of an off farm job. Right. [00:28:40] Speaker B: So you can keep food on your table. [00:28:42] Speaker A: Right. [00:28:42] Speaker B: And keep eating. Keep the lights on while you're trying, while you're doing this thing. Not knowing what tomorrow is going to bring with your, with your crops, whether they be beef, pork, soybeans, corn. It's just really, it's a lot of uncertainty. [00:29:02] Speaker A: Yeah. Another interesting thing to me is that the majority of farmers are traveling outside even the county that they live in. [00:29:13] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:29:14] Speaker A: In order to do their off farm work. [00:29:17] Speaker B: Yeah, that, that was interesting. Well, the amount of people living in rural communities has dropped so dramatically over the past like 30 years. It's really, it went from, I don't, I was reading it like 51% down to like 12 it, that you can put the information on the board or on the, on the, the screen. But the fact is not very many people live in rural communities that are farming dependent communities. The ones that do are now driving to get to their, to their jobs. [00:29:54] Speaker A: Yes. We have percent drive outside their county. [00:29:58] Speaker B: We have our neighbors right next door to us. They actually drive through the neighboring county which happens to be the neighboring state also. They both work in a hospital down there. They're, they're A good hour away from where we live. [00:30:13] Speaker A: Right. [00:30:14] Speaker B: And they farm. They have, they have cattle. [00:30:18] Speaker A: They fall into that 10%. [00:30:20] Speaker B: They sure do. [00:30:21] Speaker A: Yeah. 10% of their income. But, you know, statistically. [00:30:24] Speaker B: Right. [00:30:25] Speaker A: They would be in that 10% of their income comes from cattle, and the rest is. [00:30:29] Speaker B: Yeah. [00:30:29] Speaker A: Off farm. Yeah. [00:30:33] Speaker B: So. But they do. We watch them come in and, and especially in the winter time, and cows need to be attended to. And we'll see them out there. 8, 30, 9 o'clock, pitch dark. [00:30:45] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:30:46] Speaker B: Out there working and farming and doing stuff on the tractor. [00:30:49] Speaker A: Right. [00:30:50] Speaker B: And we're going, whoa. I. I mean, I got this in me, but I don't know if I got that in me, you know, to be out there doing that, that late. But, man, they're not alone. [00:31:00] Speaker A: They're working it. [00:31:01] Speaker B: Yeah, they're working, they're hustling. [00:31:03] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:31:03] Speaker B: You know, they want to have cows, they want to have land, they want to have something that is agricultural. They, they both long to work their land and they. And teach their kids and, and they're doing it. They're. They're doing it. [00:31:20] Speaker A: Yeah, they absolutely are. I can't. I just. I know. And now the end of my career, the commute was extra special because I, I spent the last five years working at the Pentagon. So the commute into and out of Washington, D.C. on a daily basis is definitely extra special. But, like, I can't. I just can't imagine at this point, you know, spending that hour, hour and a half one way on the road every day and farming. [00:31:53] Speaker B: Yeah. Not after we farm. Yeah. A job, it wouldn't be. That wouldn't be possible. Having a garden and a few chickens, you know, that's, that, that's, that's a very nice thing to have and do, but to have actual livestock out there relying on you and needing to be rotated and all the things that go with it, like. No, that would be. That would be really, really hard at the level that we're going for. Sure. [00:32:20] Speaker A: All right, let's land this plane. [00:32:23] Speaker B: Let's land the plane. [00:32:24] Speaker A: Okay, so some, some thoughts that we want to throw out to you off farm income is strategic. It's not failure. It is resilience. [00:32:38] Speaker B: Yeah. Knowing that you have that financial source coming in that is allowing you to live the lifestyle that you want to live and be free of other sources of food and do the life that you want is so incredibly important. And it is absolutely a strategy. [00:33:04] Speaker A: Yes. And I think if we. And it's not. It's almost like redefine, you know, like the, the. It is not. I'll, I'll repeat what I said at the beginning. It's not failure. Right? Like, it's not a. Well, we haven't gotten to the place where we can blah yet, you know, like. No, it's just reality. It's farming. It's, it's grit, it's, it's hustle and bustle. And like, it is, you are, you are displaying something that is just amazing to me that the, the gumption that it takes to farm, knowing that you're have another job. [00:33:59] Speaker B: And it is worth it. [00:34:01] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:34:01] Speaker B: I mean, it is. So it is worth it. We were out this morning doing some stuff with the, with the pigs. And I was standing there watching the little piglets because they're just hilarious. And all I could think was, this adds joy to my life. This, these moments right here are what truly add joy to what we're doing. Yes, it's hot. Yes, we have ticks. Yes. All of the things that go that, they'll aggravate you. Bad things happen, storms come. All of the things that whenever you're standing there and you see that, it adds joy to your life, or when you go down, you know, to the other pasture where there are feeder pigs that are being grown out and you see, like, man, that guy's 300 pounds, he's looking good. That is some amazing food. Being grown, that adds joy to my life. [00:34:55] Speaker A: It's interesting because, I mean, we did our, the chores this morning together and I was having those types, same types of thoughts as we moved the meat chickens onto fresh pasture. I'm standing and pulling the chicken tractor and I'm looking down at these, you know, four and a half, five week old birds and they are, they're like elated with the new grass, you know, and there's bugs and they're excited and there was some cow poop and, you know, they were just like, oh, you know, they were so happy. And I'm like, okay, this is, this is cool. [00:35:32] Speaker B: Right? This adds joy to our life and it adds incredible, clean, GMO free, pastured, delicious food to our community. [00:35:44] Speaker A: Right? [00:35:44] Speaker B: So the bonus. And yes, it does begin to pay for itself. [00:35:49] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:35:49] Speaker B: Yes, you do have to hustle. Yes, you, you got to work hard at it and you got to learn things that you never thought you were going to learn. You know, you're going to do things you never thought you were going to have to do. Because I didn't ever know that I was going to have to pull lambs out of a, out of a Ewe. Ever. I didn't think that. But there we were a couple nights ago, you know, a you was kind of struggling giving birth and I mean, we never missed a beat. We just kind of went out there and pulled them out and next morning they were just as good as you please, you know, but we didn't know. Or you didn't know you were going to have to learn how to build a website or whatever. [00:36:26] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:36:27] Speaker B: But man, we're not bored. We're having fun and we're figuring out how to make it pay the bills. [00:36:35] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:36:35] Speaker B: And we're very close and I hope you are too. [00:36:38] Speaker A: Yeah. So encouraging words to you. You are a farmer. If you're. [00:36:45] Speaker B: Absolutely. [00:36:46] Speaker A: If you're growing food, you're a farmer. The fact that you have an off farm job doesn't matter. We all do. [00:36:54] Speaker B: And maybe it lets you be a farmer. [00:36:57] Speaker A: Yeah, exactly. All right, so I am interested in your off farm job and your experience that you're having. So leave us a comment and talk to us about your farming experience and your off farm job and what that looks like. And if you're able to do it without an off farm job, I'd really love to know that. That'd be. That'd be cool. [00:37:20] Speaker B: Yeah. Hey, I want to tee up real quick. We are lining up a conversation with some college students next week from our alma mater down at University of Central Florida. And what are these kids doing that we that like? It sounds so cool. [00:37:38] Speaker A: They're farming worms, right? [00:37:41] Speaker B: Are they farmers? Yeah, they are working their off farm job, going to school too, lining it up. So anyway, next week, I believe it'll be next week's episode. That's who we're going to be chatting with and we're excited to see what these kids are doing and innovating down there. UCF is an innovation school and they are down there figuring out how to use worms. [00:38:04] Speaker A: Yeah. [00:38:05] Speaker B: So that's going to be fun. [00:38:06] Speaker A: I want to give a special shout out welcome to Spotify listeners. There's quite a few of you out there now. And welcome to the Duster Mud podcast. [00:38:17] Speaker B: Until next time, bye.